path: root/2025/captions/emacsconf-2025-hyperboleqa--questions-and-answers-to-help-you-fly-with-hyperbole--bob-weiner--main.vtt

WEBVTT

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All right, you're good to go. Are people here?

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Let me read the first question to you since I'm here.

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The first question here is,

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I'm excited to know opinion and current state

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of using NCP and AI for PKMs and PIEs.

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Since they do carry a lot of burden out of us, it means a lot of process.

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How does our pipeline stand with the coming days?

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Thanks for the question.

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AI is obviously on everybody's mind.

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We haven't done a lot of integration

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with any of the popular AI engines,

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but I think as you'll see through this Q&A session,

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Hyperbole's function is really to interlink

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your information everywhere throughout Emacs.

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And so, whether you're using a chatbot

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in a specific buffer,

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you can use hyperbole implicit links, implicit buttons

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to activate different actions there as well.

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So sometimes it takes a bit of customization,

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a small amount of two to seven lines of code to do that.

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As we get to working with more of these engines,

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we'll build that into the core part of Hyperbole.

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But right now, that's left as an extension

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for users who are heavily using MCP

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or other protocols right now.

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We have, for example, integrated

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with LSPs, you know, for coding and have that interface through xref

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and basically using the single key, the action key,

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which is made a return.

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You can jump around to any of your source definitions

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from any reference in almost any language

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that anybody uses today. So you can extrapolate from that

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how that might work with AI as well.

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And I think you'll see later when we talk about HiWiki

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that we're now enabling just just wiki words

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to be buttons in hyperbole.

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So those could be part of your chat with an AI

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and you just click on it and you jump right to all your references

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associated with that terminology. Thanks for the question.

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Should I just go through the second question?

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I thought people would be glad.

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As a normal user who codes and takes notes,

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I really want to deep dive and learn Hyperbole,

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but always end up winding back up to Embark

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and Org Mode being the better system.

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For me, Hyperbole looks over engineering

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or over the peer system,

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which other individual packages do well.

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And outside DMAC, there's no system supporting Hyperbole or any usability.

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And I think you've cited answering

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that already, so go ahead.

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Right, hyperbole is large, but there's reasons behind that.

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We're just trying to link all your information in Emacs.

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So I think you can see my screen here in Emacs.

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So for example, you can take any Lisp expression,

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even a variable like here we have in hyperbole

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Hyperbdur variable

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and I just hit the action key made a return

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and in my mini buffer I see the value of that variable,

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but I could just as well take any other expression

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and take the outer parens off

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and change them to angle brackets

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and now that's a live Hyper button

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could be in a comment in a programming buffer in this case.

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It's in K outliner buffer,

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which is a an auto-numbered outliner part of hyperbole.

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So let's just try this and say made a return.

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I pressed and it ran occur and found all the occurrences of buttons.

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And similarly in here, I could just jump and go

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to any of these lines directly

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by hitting made a return in that buffer as well.

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So all your text, all your sort

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of what we call implicit links become live and hyperbole.

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And you didn't have to learn much.

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You just learn, you know, if you know a little Lisp

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or how to type any expression,

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then you just change the outer brackets.

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And all of a sudden, you have hyperbuttons.

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So hyperbole, you can learn a little bit at a time.

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And although it seems daunting at first

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because it has so much functionality,

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very large and rich architecture.

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But what we do is teach people one piece at a time.

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So just to continue on that a little bit,

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implicit buttons are buttons

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that exist just from the text pattern in the buffer.

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So you saw an example of changing Lisp into implicit buttons right there.

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I could do keystrokes.

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I can just type them out in my buffer

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and surround them with braces.

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So here's something, let's see,

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this is actually a command in the K Outliner

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to jump to the cell numbered four. So let's just do that.

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And it took me right there, right?

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So I'm just pressing made a return to activate these buttons.

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Similarly, any sort of, this is a complex example,

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but any path name I can surround with double quotes,

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and it's a live hyper button.

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In this case, I want to jump to a path name called readme.md,

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but it's in a directory that's specified

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by an actual list variable. And then I want to go directly

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to a headline within that file called hyperbole manual.

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And within that headline, I wanna go

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to the eighth line relative to that.

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So all I have to do, made a return again,

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and boom, I'm in that, I'm directly linked to that.

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And Hyperbole has ways that you can just split your windows like this

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and create that reference in the source buffer right there.

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You just press a few keys and it'll embed that link.

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We'll see that a little later.

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Another example, so all of these buttons,

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if I just show you here,

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you can press Control-H, Capital-A anytime.

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and it will show you exactly

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what made a return will do in that context.

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In this case, it's an implicit button,

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and it shows you even where the button starts and ends,

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what type of action it will run,

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it's a link to a file line,

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and then what arguments it takes.

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So Hyperbole extracts all this meta information

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just from the text in your buffer

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and displays it to you conveniently

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so you can know before you ever touch a hyper button

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if it will do something that you want it to do.

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Here we have a fairly advanced button

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that's very simple to do. You just specify a bug in Emacs

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that you want to reference to.

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Notice no delimiters, just bug pound, whatever, made a return.

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And I'm in GNU's reading the conversation for that bug.

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And I can just, you know, move

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through all the conversation.

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I can quit out of there and go back to where I was.

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So very, very easy to use these implicit buttons

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because they're already there

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throughout your Emacs buffers.

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I described the control HA, what that does.

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And there's other types of buttons

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that we can get into as questions go on,

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but you can create your own explicit buttons

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that have a little slightly different delimiter than you see

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in the implicit buttons.

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And this one I just put in here to show you that

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If you use it and you go, this is the hyperbole to do list,

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which is an org buffer.

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But I wanted to show in here that similarly,

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we have implicit buttons for to do's in the work.

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And when we hit made a return,

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it just changes the state of that to do.

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And I can cycle through those

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but even better with the prefix argument

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if I have multiple sequences of to do's

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because there's Bob and Matt's that maintain hyperbole

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so I can shift to Bob's to do's

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with control you made a return

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and then cycle through the states for me

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So very very easy to use,

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you know something that's a little bit more difficult to do

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I think in org without it and So that's an explicit button

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where I had to actually say I want to create this button,

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and I had to specify what type it is.

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If I show you the information there again,

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you see it has a little different type

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called a keyboard key, which runs just the key sequence.

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So you're starting to see already

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that explicit buttons have a type

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that's connected to an action

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that an implicit button can do as well.

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So all of this ties back together.

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And finally, there's a homepage that Hyperbole has,

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a personal homepage that you have.

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You hit Control-H-H, which is our mini-buffer menu,

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and then you hit what is it, B for button file

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and then P for personal file.

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And that just brings you to basically a set of links

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that you can create buttons in any format you want.

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There's no structure that you see here.

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But the nice thing is that all of these buttons that have these names, as we call them,

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with the delimiters here,

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can be referenced now as what we call global buttons

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wherever you are in Emacs. So I'm in a separate buffer here

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and say I want to jump to that to-do button

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that's labeled TD on line 10 down there.

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No matter what I have on screen,

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I can hit control H, H, G for global button,

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A for activate, and then it gives me a list of those.

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So I know it's TD, I just put TD in.

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Okay, that's a path link problem I have,

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but when I fix the link, it would go to it.

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So you can create buttons

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that you can access in any mode, anywhere,

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and just give them quick names, and it's very easy.

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So that kind of gives you an idea

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of how you can get very productive

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with hyperbole with just a few simple techniques.

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You still there Sacha? Yep, I'm still here.

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I have too many tabs.

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So the question is, I've been using activities.el

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and bufferload to save dedicated workplaces,

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open buffers, and decisions in tabs and frames

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for tasks and projects across the next sessions.

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Can I do something similar with Hyper-V? Yes, you can.

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And activities is a nice package from alphapapa.

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We've actually been working with it lately.

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So we're probably in the next month or so

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we'll have a specific integration

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to activities built into Hyperbole.

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But right now, we don't. But of course, you can call

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any of its functions or key bindings

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using the techniques that I just showed you earlier.

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But what we do have built in if you go to the menu again.

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and you see control HH,

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and then there's a W, Windows, WinConfig menu,

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and there's two types of window configurations that you can save here.

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They are, right now, they're per Emacs session.

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They're not stored beyond that,

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but we'll probably add that in as well,

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or we'll use activities for that.

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so the two types are you can either just save a window configuration in a frame

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to actually it stores the frame configuration

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to a ring just like the kill ring

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so you have the three commands at the right

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you can save with an s you can pop one off the ring with p

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or you can just yank and keep cycling through with a y

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and it will restore the frame configuration that you saved.

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Similarly you can just do it by name

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and you can say I want to add a name

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and then you know just give it a name again win win C and store it and it stores it there

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and then you can get back to it by name as well.

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So fairly fairly easy to use as well

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and again integrated in the same simple menu system.

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So thanks for that question.

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Should I just go to the next question?

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How well do hyperbole and org mode work together?

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Is there any kind of integration?

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Yes, in fact, that's really good.

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I'll just mention something. Let me go back to my homepage.

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I just stored that here. So we gave a talk at an earlier

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Emacs conference right here on org

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and hyperbole integration.

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So that's a good one to go back to.

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And I believe it's in this files

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included with hyperbole as well.

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So you can learn various techniques

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of how the action key helps you in org.

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It does special things in tables.

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And there's some nice support for, for example, working with code blocks.

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Let me see where that is. Okay, so right back here.

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So you can run them with the action key.

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You can refresh the output and do things like that.

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So again, if I just hit Control-H-A,

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it'll tell me that it's in SmartOrg,

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and it'll give me all the different contexts that that operates within.

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So there's a lot that it does in here.

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And you can see it would point on the dir value of a code block definition

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that will actually display a summary

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and all sorts of functionality.

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So the integration is quite tight.

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And one of the things we do

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since made return is used in org,

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we have a customization setting, C even O.

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And you have these three settings where you can say,

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I want me to return to, I want hyperbole to control that

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and everything that the action key does I want to happen.

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Or I only want hyperbole to control

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when I'm over a hyperbole implicit explicit button.

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Or I want org to control that key and never use hyperbole.

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So you just set that once,

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it's persistent across sessions and you're good to go.

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And again, it's built right into the menus.

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So but even following that we've the latest addition to hyperbole is Something

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and this is the first time

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we're really showing it publicly is the high wiki

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Which is a new subsystem as we call it

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and this is I think the best wiki capability in Emacs now what it does is it automatically highlights

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let me turn it on I have to turn on high wiki mode

00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:54.679
and you see those wiki words now got highlighted so any any wiki word

00:16:54.680 --> 00:16:58.839
which is the capitalized alpha word you know

00:16:58.840 --> 00:17:01.439
so you can have multiple capitals in there

00:17:01.440 --> 00:17:06.039
and I'll get recognized can be used as a wiki word

00:17:06.040 --> 00:17:09.519
so for example when I just type hi wiki here

00:17:09.520 --> 00:17:11.559
it automatically recognizes it,

00:17:11.560 --> 00:17:14.239
and you see it turned it into a hyperlink button,

00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:18.159
which again, Control-H-A will tell me exactly what it does there.

00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:23.119
But I can just hit the action key, made a return,

00:17:23.120 --> 00:17:26.879
and it'll display my hiwiki.org file.

00:17:26.880 --> 00:17:30.559
All wiki pages are org files.

00:17:30.560 --> 00:17:35.679
So we're using that for the wikis, and you have

00:17:35.680 --> 00:17:40.359
You can export an entire wiki

00:17:40.360 --> 00:17:43.159
using essentially the org export capability

00:17:43.160 --> 00:17:48.599
With a little extra set of features that we've added in

00:17:48.600 --> 00:17:51.199
but let's say even better you see

00:17:51.200 --> 00:17:54.119
I have this heading here so let me just change this

00:17:54.120 --> 00:17:59.239
you go back here and I'll say go to heading

00:17:59.240 --> 00:18:01.039
so you just put a pound on it

00:18:01.040 --> 00:18:05.679
and now that whole thing is a reference to a specific org section.

00:18:05.680 --> 00:18:08.439
Notice there's no org IDs here.

00:18:08.440 --> 00:18:11.639
There's nothing other than the text that you're seeing.

00:18:11.640 --> 00:18:13.439
There's not even a delimiter.

00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:17.839
So we have automatic implicit hyper buttons

00:18:17.840 --> 00:18:20.679
being added in any buffer.

00:18:20.680 --> 00:18:23.959
Could be a comment in a programming buffer with all you

00:18:23.960 --> 00:18:26.599
You don't have to add anything.

00:18:26.600 --> 00:18:31.999
I'll show you how to create a new page in a minute.

00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:35.959
But you see I can link to any org section without any IDs.

00:18:35.960 --> 00:18:38.799
And then I can also do like org-roam does,

00:18:38.800 --> 00:18:42.039
but without the indexing or database that it requires.

00:18:42.040 --> 00:18:46.839
I can scan over all of my wiki files and headings.

00:18:46.840 --> 00:18:48.759
find a match really quickly.

00:18:48.760 --> 00:18:53.279
So we can get into some of that a little later as well.

00:18:53.280 --> 00:18:55.759
But, you know, very convenient.

00:18:55.760 --> 00:18:58.439
There's nothing that you change on org to do this.

00:18:58.440 --> 00:19:00.879
So how do I create a wiki word?

00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:07.359
Well, let's say I wanted, you know, wiki word for me.

00:19:07.360 --> 00:19:09.999
So that's already, that was a wiki word,

00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:12.959
but now this is a new one. So you see it doesn't highlight

00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:16.559
because I haven't created a wiki page yet.

00:19:16.560 --> 00:19:20.319
So all I hit is the action key, and boom.

00:19:20.320 --> 00:19:23.519
Now it created it as a new wiki word.

00:19:23.520 --> 00:19:24.879
It created the .org file.

00:19:24.880 --> 00:19:28.279
If I don't edit this file, it won't save it,

00:19:28.280 --> 00:19:32.359
and it'll not become a word in case you made an accident.

00:19:32.360 --> 00:19:34.319
But let's just say I want to say it.

00:19:34.320 --> 00:19:39.159
So, you know, heading. That's it. I'm just in org mode.

00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:42.879
Now anytime that high wiki mode is active,

00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:46.239
in any buffer essentially,

00:19:46.240 --> 00:19:50.279
I can type that out and it'll recognize it.

00:19:50.280 --> 00:19:53.039
Notice so that's not a wiki word.

00:19:53.040 --> 00:19:55.279
So it's highlighting and it's unhighlighting

00:19:55.280 --> 00:19:56.599
right as I type.

00:19:56.600 --> 00:20:03.199
So, again, you can embed these as org links in org.

00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:09.439
There's a special format like this, HiWiki word

00:20:09.440 --> 00:20:11.239
that you can make an org link

00:20:11.240 --> 00:20:13.479
if I was in org mode, just like that.

00:20:13.480 --> 00:20:16.599
So there's all sorts of compatibility,

00:20:16.600 --> 00:20:18.319
but basically it's just words,

00:20:18.320 --> 00:20:21.119
and HiWiki takes care of the rest for you.

00:20:21.120 --> 00:20:26.679
So there's a directory where all these, it's HiWiki,

00:20:26.680 --> 00:20:28.879
hi wiki tilde slash

00:20:28.880 --> 00:20:32.719
hi wiki is the default place where all these would be found

00:20:32.720 --> 00:20:36.359
and there's a menu now in hyperbole for hi wiki h

00:20:36.360 --> 00:20:40.639
and you can see it has a lot of capabilities

00:20:40.640 --> 00:20:44.359
but i can say b go into the directory of all the files

00:20:44.360 --> 00:20:47.799
just pull them up and any of these you'll see

00:20:47.800 --> 00:20:59.959
let me give you one like this me okay so you can see the other wiki words being highlighted in here

00:20:59.960 --> 00:21:04.039
so it's very fast to this there's almost no delay for anything

00:21:04.040 --> 00:21:14.679
and yet very flexible and you have this ability you know where you could type emacs section dash 1 dash 2

00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:16.759
and If you didn't have delimiters around it,

00:21:16.760 --> 00:21:18.479
but you can put any delimiters

00:21:18.480 --> 00:21:20.839
like double quotes or parentheses,

00:21:20.840 --> 00:21:25.159
and then it'll match without you having to change the header at all

00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:28.439
with the spaces included and all of those.

00:21:28.440 --> 00:21:31.919
know will get recognized.

00:21:31.920 --> 00:21:35.599
I don't know if this if the section exists right there.

00:21:35.600 --> 00:21:41.959
So anyway a lot of capability you can see that here where I did the high

00:21:41.960 --> 00:21:45.519
it actually highlights as an org link

00:21:45.520 --> 00:21:46.839
because it is an org link

00:21:46.840 --> 00:21:50.319
and it'll operate just like any other org link

00:21:50.320 --> 00:21:54.279
even though it's a high wiki word link as well.

00:21:54.280 --> 00:21:55.759
So very powerful stuff

00:21:55.760 --> 00:22:00.959
and totally integrated with Org Mode throughout.

00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:06.439
Great. There's another question.

00:22:06.440 --> 00:22:09.039
Are there any talks from this year's Emacs Conf

00:22:09.040 --> 00:22:12.599
that discuss things that would work well with Hyperbole?

00:22:12.600 --> 00:22:19.279
No. Unfortunately, I had to work yesterday, so I haven't...

00:22:19.280 --> 00:22:22.639
been following the conference as much as I do.

00:22:22.640 --> 00:22:25.559
Maybe somebody else could comment on that.

00:22:25.560 --> 00:22:29.519
But I think, you know, again,

00:22:29.520 --> 00:22:31.879
it's like pick your favorite mode,

00:22:31.880 --> 00:22:34.719
pick your favorite type of information.

00:22:34.720 --> 00:22:36.839
Can I hyperbole work with that?

00:22:36.840 --> 00:22:39.999
You know, the answer is almost always yes.

00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:44.959
So, you know, if I show you just a little bit,

00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:48.679
if I show you some of these implicit button types,

00:22:48.680 --> 00:22:53.359
just so you know the amount of code

00:22:53.360 --> 00:22:56.279
involved to create a type.

00:22:56.280 --> 00:22:59.679
So here's like a male, recognizing

00:22:59.680 --> 00:23:01.639
an email address as a button.

00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:05.519
It's a little long so that it creates a lot of things

00:23:05.520 --> 00:23:09.199
but you know it's less than 15 lines of code for that.

00:23:09.200 --> 00:23:12.199
Path names are complicated so that's a longer one

00:23:12.200 --> 00:23:18.799
but let's look at so here's one recognizing a bibliography entry.

00:23:18.800 --> 00:23:24.879
So it can be between two and 20 lines of code

00:23:24.880 --> 00:23:27.519
to create an entirely new button type.

00:23:27.520 --> 00:23:32.159
And you create it once, and you just add it to the set of types,

00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:35.479
just like at the fun, except it's done with this macro

00:23:35.480 --> 00:23:39.479
called def, implicit button type, and defib.

00:23:39.480 --> 00:23:45.559
And it's part of your hyperlinking system forever then.

00:23:45.560 --> 00:23:49.799
So say you got dumped with 5,000 documents

00:23:49.800 --> 00:23:51.519
that were in this weird text format,

00:23:51.520 --> 00:23:54.119
and they all had cross-references among them,

00:23:54.120 --> 00:23:56.792
but it was, again, using a weird format.

00:23:56.760 --> 00:23:59.919
You could just write your own little type for that,

00:23:59.920 --> 00:24:04.319
and then those 5,000 documents are hyperlinked for you

00:24:04.320 --> 00:24:08.759
every time you're browsing them in Emacs automatically.

00:24:08.760 --> 00:24:11.959
So we do that all the time, create small things,

00:24:11.960 --> 00:24:15.159
but all of these are built into Hyperbole.

00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:20.199
Markdown links, tech info links, all of that's automatic.

00:24:20.200 --> 00:24:26.199
I could even be in a shell mode, and I just say ls,

00:24:26.200 --> 00:24:30.519
and these are hyperlinks that Hyperbole understands, right?

00:24:30.520 --> 00:24:31.759
It just jumps right to the file.

00:24:31.760 --> 00:24:36.999
So grep-n, You know, looking at any line numbers,

00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:39.839
you don't have to remember

00:24:39.840 --> 00:24:41.959
all these different commands anymore.

00:24:41.960 --> 00:24:44.319
You just hit made a return,

00:24:44.320 --> 00:24:46.599
and Hyperbole does the right thing

00:24:46.600 --> 00:24:48.359
in all these different contexts,

00:24:48.360 --> 00:24:52.639
including following cross-references in code.

00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:56.079
So I would say that's your answer.

00:24:56.080 --> 00:24:58.399
Most things that people are talking about,

00:24:58.400 --> 00:25:02.199
we've already probably integrated with Hyperbole

00:25:02.200 --> 00:25:04.639
or with a little bit of custom coding.

00:25:04.640 --> 00:25:11.199
You can do it. I think that's the end of the etherpad questions for now,

00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:12.919
but I see a number of people in the room,

00:25:12.920 --> 00:25:15.439
so you can continue the conversation.

00:25:15.440 --> 00:25:18.719
We'll be on the stream for another five minutes or so,

00:25:18.720 --> 00:25:22.319
but yes, please go ahead. Great. Yeah.

00:25:22.320 --> 00:25:27.639
I mean, people, does everybody have, can talk on the conference?

00:25:27.640 --> 00:25:31.439
I was expecting to just talk with people here.

00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:40.799
Let's see. Yeah. Can anybody say anything here?

00:25:40.800 --> 00:25:52.039
Hi, Bob. I can say something. Hey, Matt. Hi. Yeah.

00:25:52.040 --> 00:25:55.199
Maybe you want to bring up a topic.

00:25:55.200 --> 00:25:56.839
I think I... Yes. Sorry, Bob.

00:25:56.840 --> 00:26:05.839
I think I saw a question here on IOC. It was like this.

00:26:05.840 --> 00:26:08.599
Interesting, but the many different link formats

00:26:08.600 --> 00:26:11.279
makes reading and analyzing my notes

00:26:11.280 --> 00:26:14.959
much harder and less usable outside Emacs.

00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:18.759
I don't know if you have some comment on that.

00:26:18.760 --> 00:26:22.319
Well, I mean, the different formats that you're saying,

00:26:22.320 --> 00:26:24.839
like angle brackets or curly braces,

00:26:24.840 --> 00:26:31.319
are just so that you can utilize many different types.

00:26:31.320 --> 00:26:35.599
of buttons, but if you just want to use key sequences,

00:26:35.600 --> 00:26:37.759
there's only one markup format.

00:26:37.760 --> 00:26:41.599
With org, you've got the square brackets,

00:26:41.600 --> 00:26:44.919
which are consistent, but in order to have different types,

00:26:44.920 --> 00:26:47.279
you have to type a prefix name,

00:26:47.280 --> 00:26:53.279
like you see the HY for the High Wiki buttons in org mode.

00:26:53.280 --> 00:26:56.999
So I think the trade-off is pretty much the same,

00:26:57.000 --> 00:27:02.239
but Hyperbole always, always works

00:27:02.240 --> 00:27:04.559
to minimize the amount of markup.

00:27:04.560 --> 00:27:07.439
Markdown is pretty simple. A lot of people like that.

00:27:07.440 --> 00:27:10.759
But I think you'll find in hyperbole texts,

00:27:10.760 --> 00:27:15.479
they read just like regular language.

00:27:15.480 --> 00:27:19.599
I mean, the delimiters are fairly invisible.

00:27:19.600 --> 00:27:23.039
So I'm not sure what the issue is there.

00:27:23.040 --> 00:27:24.919
And again, you can choose your own.

00:27:24.920 --> 00:27:27.639
You can make your own types with your own delimiters.

00:27:27.640 --> 00:27:31.359
There's even a custom macro

00:27:31.360 --> 00:27:33.399
that instead of using that defib

00:27:33.400 --> 00:27:35.559
where you have to type out list code,

00:27:35.560 --> 00:27:37.519
you can use regular expressions.

00:27:37.520 --> 00:27:41.239
And in one line, you can define your own type of button

00:27:41.240 --> 00:27:42.919
with its own delimiters.

00:27:42.920 --> 00:27:47.879
So, you know, depending on what works well for your eyes,

00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:51.359
you can make Hyperbole adapt quite well to that.

00:27:51.360 --> 00:27:54.319
And again, if you start using the HiWiki,

00:27:54.320 --> 00:27:57.479
there's literally zero markup on that.

00:27:57.480 --> 00:27:59.599
So you're just reading text,

00:27:59.600 --> 00:28:01.759
and when you want something hyperlinked,

00:28:01.760 --> 00:28:04.599
it's like a glossary or a dictionary entry.

00:28:04.600 --> 00:28:09.599
It's just there, and it's just highlighted in the text.

00:28:09.600 --> 00:28:17.479
So I don't see much barrier to using it with many different types of documents.

00:28:17.480 --> 00:28:23.319
Let me go back to the Emacs here.

00:28:23.320 --> 00:28:27.039
If there are any other questions.

00:28:27.040 --> 00:28:36.639
Let me see. Let me go back to that. This K outline here.

00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:38.719
So we covered HiWiki.

00:28:38.720 --> 00:28:42.999
We're in the, I'll just show you some things

00:28:43.000 --> 00:28:44.039
that we wanted to highlight

00:28:44.040 --> 00:28:46.279
if people didn't have specific questions.

00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:48.879
But feel free to jump in anytime

00:28:48.880 --> 00:28:51.399
if you want to ask something.

00:28:51.400 --> 00:28:57.039
So what we're looking at here is a K Outliner document.

00:28:57.040 --> 00:29:00.399
There's, you know, hyperbole is pretty well documented.

00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:04.719
There's a large manual. There's interactive.

00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:09.319
demos of it and there are videos as well

00:29:09.320 --> 00:29:12.079
but the K Outliner is unique in Emacs

00:29:12.080 --> 00:29:17.439
because it it can do like full legal auto numbering you

00:29:17.440 --> 00:29:21.399
just say I want to create a new headline

00:29:21.400 --> 00:29:23.919
and you can see or I could create four

00:29:23.920 --> 00:29:26.679
I could say I want to create three more of these

00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:29.239
and I can do it all at once with one key

00:29:29.240 --> 00:29:33.679
I can then just tab to make sublevels here

00:29:33.680 --> 00:29:40.319
and you see this is using a specific outline format that we have

00:29:40.320 --> 00:29:43.919
but if we do dot in the view specs here

00:29:43.920 --> 00:29:48.239
it changes to legal outlining so it's really that simple

00:29:48.240 --> 00:29:51.399
and all of these numbers are automatically maintained

00:29:51.400 --> 00:29:56.639
as I move stuff around I can use like org mode alt arrow keys

00:29:56.640 --> 00:30:00.119
to like move things up and down, right?

00:30:00.120 --> 00:30:00.839
And just move them around.

00:30:00.840 --> 00:30:04.719
And when I run out, you know, when it can't go any higher,

00:30:04.720 --> 00:30:06.039
it gives me an error.

00:30:06.040 --> 00:30:11.079
And then it's just free form typing here with auto-wrapping.

00:30:11.080 --> 00:30:13.759
The nice thing is that there's,

00:30:13.760 --> 00:30:17.359
there's actually these hidden,

00:30:17.360 --> 00:30:22.519
let's get, hidden what are called ID stamps.

00:30:22.520 --> 00:30:24.919
So these are permanent hyperlink anchors

00:30:24.920 --> 00:30:26.719
that are assigned to each cell.

00:30:26.720 --> 00:30:29.679
So as this cell moves in the outline,

00:30:29.680 --> 00:30:32.679
you notice that this 29 didn't change.

00:30:32.680 --> 00:30:37.439
So you can move and all those other auto numbers shift

00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:40.359
to represent the actual outline structure.

00:30:40.360 --> 00:30:44.079
But this ID stamp of 29 stays the same.

00:30:44.080 --> 00:30:47.679
So you can embed that in links and say,

00:30:47.680 --> 00:30:51.719
I want to link to cell 29.

00:30:51.720 --> 00:30:55.999
If I go, let me just go to the K Outliner example.

00:30:56.000 --> 00:30:59.039
And I'll show you one of those, which is really cool.

00:30:59.040 --> 00:31:02.599
Because what you can do is say, I want to link

00:31:02.600 --> 00:31:06.999
Let me find that. It's down here somewhere.

00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:12.199
I think there's 3A. Where was it? Yeah, okay.

00:31:12.200 --> 00:31:16.479
So see right here, this is an internal link

00:31:16.480 --> 00:31:21.200
with just the pound and then the relative ID, as we call it, 3B.

00:31:21.200 --> 00:31:25.719
But of course, somebody may have moved 3B in the outline.

00:31:25.720 --> 00:31:27.919
So when Hyperbole inserts a link,

00:31:27.920 --> 00:31:32.039
it puts this equal with the ID stamp in it automatically.

00:31:32.040 --> 00:31:35.839
So if what'll happen is when I reference this,

00:31:35.840 --> 00:31:37.639
okay, it's still the same.

00:31:37.640 --> 00:31:40.959
But if it had changed, it would update this link

00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:44.759
and would change the 3B to say it was 3D now

00:31:44.760 --> 00:31:50.519
based on this permalink, the 08 that's hidden away in here.

00:31:50.520 --> 00:31:52.439
So you don't have to do anything.

00:31:52.440 --> 00:31:56.599
It's just that you have these automatic hyperlink anchors

00:31:56.600 --> 00:31:58.959
that are embedded in your outlines again.

00:31:58.960 --> 00:32:04.519
sort of like org IDs, but you have to manually place those in org.

00:32:04.520 --> 00:32:09.039
And it just makes linking much simpler.

00:32:09.040 --> 00:32:10.359
And you can reference this.

00:32:10.360 --> 00:32:13.799
You can reference the file and the cell number.

00:32:13.800 --> 00:32:15.999
And again, you don't put this hyperbole.

00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:17.679
You don't put this in.

00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:20.719
And then you can even have these view specs, which say,

00:32:20.720 --> 00:32:25.919
I want to clip the display to one line,

00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:27.399
and I want to delete. ellipses.

00:32:27.400 --> 00:32:31.079
So here we see a view over the same outline

00:32:31.080 --> 00:32:37.319
that's all in one mode. So it's just incredibly capable.

00:32:37.320 --> 00:32:40.079
So here we've said, you know,

00:32:40.080 --> 00:32:42.879
there's no blank lines between cells.

00:32:42.880 --> 00:32:46.719
now I change the view spec and put a blank line in there

00:32:46.720 --> 00:32:51.879
and it's all changed so lots of consistency that you get

00:32:51.880 --> 00:32:55.599
when you when you change a node in the outline

00:32:55.600 --> 00:32:58.799
the whole tree shifts and all of this is maintained

00:32:58.800 --> 00:33:02.839
all of the structure is maintained automatically by hyperbole

00:33:02.840 --> 00:33:09.479
and you can embed or Tables in here as well.

00:33:09.480 --> 00:33:17.079
So if I just press made a return action key again on this or Disabled.

00:33:17.080 --> 00:33:21.799
Okay. So now I enabled org mode here

00:33:21.800 --> 00:33:31.719
and where you see like tab here shifts a cell when I'm inside a The table tab just operates like normal org tables.

00:33:31.720 --> 00:33:33.519
So I can do all of the things

00:33:33.520 --> 00:33:40.839
that I can do in org table mode as well within this k-outline.

00:33:40.840 --> 00:33:43.399
So it seems pretty useful to me,

00:33:43.400 --> 00:33:48.519
but of course, I helped write it.

00:33:48.520 --> 00:33:51.279
But I think you see some of the benefits

00:33:51.280 --> 00:33:53.959
that can accrue by using that format.

00:33:53.960 --> 00:33:57.839
But this is just this is just one piece of hyperbole,

00:33:57.840 --> 00:34:01.559
a major mode that you can choose to use or ignore entirely,

00:34:01.560 --> 00:34:04.039
you know, dependent on your needs.

00:34:04.040 --> 00:34:06.399
If you're writing requirements, documents,

00:34:06.400 --> 00:34:08.879
or anything that needs structure,

00:34:08.880 --> 00:34:12.079
I think that's where this is really ideal.

00:34:12.080 --> 00:34:14.279
You can write a legal document,

00:34:14.280 --> 00:34:16.159
and you've got auto-numbering,

00:34:16.160 --> 00:34:18.679
which is always, if you've ever used Word

00:34:18.680 --> 00:34:21.039
or any of those word processors,

00:34:21.040 --> 00:34:26.479
it's really a pain to maintain those hierarchies in those compared to here.

00:34:26.480 --> 00:34:32.239
Okay, so that was just showing you the KL liner.

00:34:32.240 --> 00:34:35.279
Does anybody have any questions

00:34:35.280 --> 00:34:43.279
or I'll just continue down a bit?

00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:47.999
Okay, so some other capabilities

00:34:48.000 --> 00:34:49.959
that we've fairly recently put in.

00:34:49.960 --> 00:34:52.799
Well, this has been here for a long time.

00:34:52.800 --> 00:34:58.719
You can, I think the binding I use is Control-C-M.

00:34:58.720 --> 00:35:00.159
I forget what it is.

00:35:00.160 --> 00:35:07.159
No, sorry, that's Control-C, Control-M.

00:35:07.160 --> 00:35:14.319
Now let's CTRL C, forward slash.

00:35:14.320 --> 00:35:21.719
Okay, so what I wanted to show you here is that the action key

00:35:21.720 --> 00:35:26.679
on any double quote, single quote, usually,

00:35:26.680 --> 00:35:30.079
or paired delimiters will select that whole thing.

00:35:30.080 --> 00:35:33.239
There is this capability, and I probably just select bigger

00:35:33.240 --> 00:35:35.119
and bigger chunks of text,

00:35:35.120 --> 00:35:39.319
but this is really nice that you can just go anywhere

00:35:39.320 --> 00:35:42.479
in pretty much any mode and hit made a return.

00:35:42.480 --> 00:35:46.559
And so in Lisp, you can be on the trailing paren

00:35:46.560 --> 00:35:50.599
and it will select the whole expression or the opening

00:35:50.600 --> 00:35:52.879
and it'll select just that piece

00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:56.159
but even better when you're copying pasting

00:35:56.160 --> 00:36:02.039
I can now if there's no region selected control W made a W

00:36:02.040 --> 00:36:05.679
will act on the structured entity

00:36:05.680 --> 00:36:09.359
that you're at the beginning or ending delimiter for

00:36:09.360 --> 00:36:12.199
without you having to highlight the region

00:36:12.200 --> 00:36:14.719
So if I hit made a return, it would highlight it,

00:36:14.720 --> 00:36:19.839
but let's just do made a W to cut that and then I'll yank it here.

00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:23.599
And you see it grabbed the whole expression

00:36:23.600 --> 00:36:25.599
and just let you yank it.

00:36:25.600 --> 00:36:29.679
So it's a nice add on to the basic Emacs commands

00:36:29.680 --> 00:36:33.159
that just let you operate a lot more efficiently.

00:36:33.160 --> 00:36:35.359
You can do something similar in C mode.

00:36:35.360 --> 00:36:39.439
You know, on the braces, you can select the whole function

00:36:39.440 --> 00:36:40.439
with one key press,

00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:43.079
made a return, and then copy it somewhere.

00:36:43.080 --> 00:36:50.559
And Hyperbole integrates with Ace Window if you use that.

00:36:50.560 --> 00:36:56.799
So let me split this a few ways. And let's do it over here.

00:36:56.800 --> 00:37:06.799
We'll just go to scratch. Okay. And then I can go,

00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:08.119
it's sort of interesting,

00:37:08.120 --> 00:37:11.120
it works with the, with Dired as well.

00:37:11.120 --> 00:37:16.519
So I can go here and say, I want to So if I do Meta O,

00:37:16.520 --> 00:37:22.159
ACE window will show me the labels to use, A, D, or S, to do something.

00:37:22.160 --> 00:37:24.559
Like I can move to any of those windows.

00:37:24.560 --> 00:37:27.959
But what Hyperbole lets you do

00:37:27.960 --> 00:37:30.759
is say I want to throw with T,

00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:36.399
like this glass.org file over to the bottom window.

00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:42.479
So I go MetaO to invoke it. I say I want a T to throw it.

00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:46.399
then where do I want to throw it to s the window and

00:37:46.400 --> 00:37:49.879
Then you see it's now displaying glass org

00:37:49.880 --> 00:37:56.679
so I can do that with files I can do it with regions of text you can

00:37:56.680 --> 00:37:58.719
Replace things in a buffer

00:37:58.720 --> 00:38:01.199
or throw the whole thing to the window

00:38:01.200 --> 00:38:02.759
so a couple extra commands

00:38:02.760 --> 00:38:06.519
that it extends ace window with you

00:38:06.520 --> 00:38:12.159
can even I think, well, we also have this command,

00:38:12.160 --> 00:38:16.799
I think it's Control-C, yeah.

00:38:16.800 --> 00:38:21.719
So what it did there was it just selected the files

00:38:21.720 --> 00:38:22.799
that I had marked in Dura,

00:38:22.800 --> 00:38:26.839
it selected and created a window grid out of all of them.

00:38:26.840 --> 00:38:29.559
you know, so I hit like three keystrokes.

00:38:29.560 --> 00:38:35.159
That's kind of convenient if you want to see

00:38:35.160 --> 00:38:38.159
a lot of information all at once.

00:38:38.160 --> 00:38:42.239
And so we covered all that. I won't go into it too much,

00:38:42.240 --> 00:38:46.639
but there's a whole nother window and frame control system

00:38:46.640 --> 00:38:50.799
under the screen menu here if you type control HHS.

00:38:50.800 --> 00:38:54.479
then you can select either controlling windows or frames.

00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:56.119
Let's do windows.

00:38:56.120 --> 00:39:00.479
And it has this menu where it's just sort of showing you.

00:39:00.480 --> 00:39:07.839
I can like split my windows vertically or horizontally.

00:39:07.840 --> 00:39:13.759
I can widen by a pixel or I can say, or character.

00:39:13.760 --> 00:39:18.319
I can say, use my prefix argument to change that to 10.

00:39:18.320 --> 00:39:22.479
And then when I shrink it, shrinks it up by 10

00:39:22.480 --> 00:39:27.319
or it narrows it width by 10 or it widens it by 10.

00:39:27.320 --> 00:39:33.679
So it has this concept of prefix arguments that persist

00:39:33.680 --> 00:39:35.719
and you just type in the number

00:39:35.720 --> 00:39:38.359
and then you can issue any number of the commands.

00:39:38.360 --> 00:39:41.679
So you could move windows or frames

00:39:41.680 --> 00:39:44.919
or create them, delete them, cycle through them,

00:39:44.920 --> 00:39:48.279
all sorts of things, including relative to movement,

00:39:48.280 --> 00:39:50.719
relative to the edges of your screens.

00:39:50.720 --> 00:39:52.559
So if you have multiple screens

00:39:52.560 --> 00:39:54.479
and many frames that you use,

00:39:54.480 --> 00:39:59.639
it just makes management very convenient.

00:39:59.640 --> 00:40:02.439
And then you just cue to quit out of there

00:40:02.440 --> 00:40:04.959
and you're back wherever you were.

00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:10.439
So, Finally, we have a lot of documentation.

00:40:10.440 --> 00:40:12.599
This is just a link to the videos,

00:40:12.600 --> 00:40:16.239
which is in the readme and in the manuals.

00:40:16.240 --> 00:40:21.399
There's two demos or tutorials. One to get you started.

00:40:21.400 --> 00:40:24.719
Notice I'm using these implicit buttons, so keystrokes,

00:40:24.720 --> 00:40:26.879
and I can just made a return on that.

00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:30.519
And that takes me to, here's all the videos.

00:40:30.520 --> 00:40:34.239
And you can get started with that

00:40:34.240 --> 00:40:38.279
or just interact with this demo that we have.

00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:41.519
And there's one for the K Outliner as well.

00:40:41.520 --> 00:40:45.399
One of the things that If you're into videos

00:40:45.400 --> 00:40:46.919
and you need to link to them,

00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:50.519
notice what you're seeing here. This is a hyperbole feature

00:40:50.520 --> 00:40:54.919
which is very difficult to achieve any other way that I've seen

00:40:54.920 --> 00:40:59.279
where you want a specific start and stop time

00:40:59.280 --> 00:41:01.039
in a video that you want to play.

00:41:01.040 --> 00:41:05.639
Hyperbole has a built-in link type for that.

00:41:05.640 --> 00:41:08.760
as you see here. So this is the name of the link

00:41:08.760 --> 00:41:10.919
that you can reference it by,

00:41:10.920 --> 00:41:14.279
and then this is the actual link expression.

00:41:14.280 --> 00:41:17.479
So I could just go and play a video right here,

00:41:17.480 --> 00:41:22.079
and this is from one long intro to hyperbole that we did.

00:41:22.080 --> 00:41:25.759
So it's just linking to the specific sections.

00:41:25.760 --> 00:41:27.439
But that's something, again,

00:41:27.440 --> 00:41:29.519
this could be embedded anywhere.

00:41:29.520 --> 00:41:33.759
in any file and it would start to play.

00:41:33.760 --> 00:41:36.559
Uh, I guess I could try YouTube.

00:41:36.560 --> 00:41:43.239
Well, I don't want to. Yeah. Okay. It's on my other screen.

00:41:43.240 --> 00:41:48.199
So, but it did, it did, uh, link to it.

00:41:48.200 --> 00:41:53.319
So, um, yeah, just, you know, tremendous capability

00:41:53.320 --> 00:41:56.919
to interlink your information that way.

00:41:56.920 --> 00:42:00.359
And, uh, You know, again, you learn it bit by bit.

00:42:00.360 --> 00:42:04.279
You can study one particular section right here.

00:42:04.280 --> 00:42:09.039
Just jump directly to that if you want to know about it.

00:42:09.040 --> 00:42:13.319
The manual is interlinked, has an extensive glossary,

00:42:13.320 --> 00:42:16.119
cross-references of sections.

00:42:16.120 --> 00:42:23.119
And if you go in there, this is the hyperlinked manual.

00:42:23.120 --> 00:42:25.119
So this is the structure of it

00:42:25.120 --> 00:42:27.799
with all the subsystems documented.

00:42:27.800 --> 00:42:31.519
But one of the sections we've added

00:42:31.520 --> 00:42:33.559
is developing with hyperbole.

00:42:33.560 --> 00:42:37.319
So if you are or you want to create your own button types,

00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:38.919
this explains how to do it.

00:42:38.920 --> 00:42:42.959
Creating types, you can create your own action

00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:44.999
and implicit button types.

00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:48.359
And if you look in here, there are three ways

00:42:48.360 --> 00:42:55.039
to create implicit button types from simpler to harder.

00:42:55.040 --> 00:42:59.079
So like, here's an example

00:42:59.080 --> 00:43:03.679
where the do pressing control X after this expression

00:43:03.680 --> 00:43:07.199
defines a new action button link type called pilot.

00:43:07.200 --> 00:43:13.359
So let's say, I don't know if I have this set up, but we can try it.

00:43:13.360 --> 00:43:21.999
Yeah, I don't have the variable setup,

00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:25.759
but basically, you know, it can get you.

00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:31.359
This is a one line definition of a new action type.

00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:36.399
that can get you to a Python file

00:43:36.400 --> 00:43:39.639
based on whatever your Python path is set to

00:43:39.640 --> 00:43:42.919
with this simple syntax right here.

00:43:42.920 --> 00:43:45.199
And here we're going to the file.

00:43:45.200 --> 00:43:48.399
So we have no idea where this is on the file system.

00:43:48.400 --> 00:43:54.959
And the same way like if you use man path, Python path,

00:43:54.960 --> 00:44:08.599
you can embed buttons. Let's just go to scratch buffer.

00:44:08.600 --> 00:44:17.919
My first read-only. It doesn't want me to go.

00:44:17.920 --> 00:44:24.999
It must be kind of strange.

00:44:25.000 --> 00:44:34.799
Something with this key window that I have over here.

00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:41.039
Let me just move off there. Look at that.

00:44:41.040 --> 00:44:46.519
Maybe it's just activating that.

00:44:46.520 --> 00:44:53.319
Yeah, it keeps jumping back there.

00:44:53.320 --> 00:44:55.919
I don't know. I have to get this straight.

00:44:55.920 --> 00:45:02.199
Yeah, it's not letting me type the buttons.

00:45:02.200 --> 00:45:15.839
Let me see if I can turn off the key casting.

00:45:15.840 --> 00:45:23.519
Yeah, maybe that'll help. just gonna exit out of here.

00:45:23.520 --> 00:45:32.960
Does anybody have any questions they want to cover?

00:45:33.000 --> 00:45:39.079
I was just gonna show you yeah a little more on type definitions

00:45:39.080 --> 00:45:53.119
if there was any interest OK, there's nobody piping up.

00:45:53.120 --> 00:45:56.999
Let me see if there's any other questions.

00:45:57.000 --> 00:46:04.439
Hi, Bob. I haven't seen any more questions.

00:46:04.440 --> 00:46:10.839
Yeah, so maybe it's you, me, and someone called Max is here in the channel.

00:46:10.840 --> 00:46:19.479
OK. Okay, so if Max doesn't have any questions

00:46:19.480 --> 00:46:24.839
and there aren't other people, we can just end it there.

00:46:24.840 --> 00:46:34.479
I don't want to have an audience of zero or talk to that.

00:46:34.480 --> 00:46:37.919
So, but I think that was a good overview, Max, right?

00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:45.479
Yes, definitely covered a lot in a short time.

00:46:45.480 --> 00:46:48.639
And hopefully, you know, just try it out.

00:46:48.640 --> 00:46:52.399
At the top here, it shows you how to install it.

00:46:52.400 --> 00:46:56.559
It's pretty simple, basic package and installation.

00:46:56.560 --> 00:47:02.719
And we're happy to help anybody get started if they need to.

00:47:02.720 --> 00:47:05.199
So thanks, everyone.

00:47:05.200 --> 00:47:09.279
And we'll answer any further questions on the Etherpad after this.