path: root/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-students--an-example-of-a-cohesive-student-workflow-in-emacs--daniel-pinkston--answers.vtt

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And I believe we are live. Hi, Daniel, how are you doing? I'm

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doing great. It's cold outside, but it's nice in here, yeah.

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I can assure you it's very cold in my own place as well. We do

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EmacsConf always in December and that's always when it's

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particularly cold where I live and I assume where you live as

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well. So, don't worry, we'll try to keep you warm with

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interesting questions. But first, thank you for taking the

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time out of your busy high school life to make a presentation

NOTE Q: Do you have any thoughts about the process of recording something for a conference?

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about Emacs. Do you have any thoughts about the process of

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recording something for a conference? Because I assume

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it's one of the first ones you're ever doing.

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I think it was not as difficult as I thought it would be. I just

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recorded in my basement and prepared some notes

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beforehand. I think it was definitely helpful to have Emacs

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as a tool for that, because I made my presentation with

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Beamer. Right. I mean, it's amazing to see so many of the

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tools because, you know, you've shown Emacs, but you've

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shown Beamer. You've shown tools that are about twice as old

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as you are yourself, which is amazing when you think about

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it. But I think many people in the audience can actually

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relate to your discovery of those tools because we were

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pretty much, I mean a lot of us were your age when we started

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playing with those tools so it's like there's a little bit of

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nostalgia that we feel looking at your presentation

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because we are, we can see the excitement behind everything

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you've touched and that's great for us because it brings us

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back maybe 10 or 20 years in the past and for others perhaps 30

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or 40 years so that's kind of amazing.

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How about we start taking some questions? So, just for

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timekeeping, we have until 20 of the current hours, which is

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8 minutes and 30 seconds to cover as many questions as

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possible. Now, if we might take the first one. So, Corwin,

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can you scroll down to the questions? Yes. I'll be reading

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you the questions just to make it a little easier for you,

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Daniel, to answer them.

NOTE Q: I use org-roam for notes and find it very useful - have you considered it?

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I use Org-roam for notes and find it

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very useful. Have you considered it? Uh, yeah, that's

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actually where I started out for taking notes. Um, that,

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that I moved to Denote because I didn't use all of its

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features, um, for, Org Roam, I meant.

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Uh, I also didn't, didn't really like the dependency on an

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external database. Uh, it just like took a while for, um,

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stuff to index if I moved it between like, uh, using sync

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thing. laptop and my desktop. Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely

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something, I mean, I co-maintain Org Roam, so I'm fully aware

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of this problem with it. And yeah, SyncThing is not great to

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sync a database, a SQLite database that we use. And, I mean,

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whichever solution you use, whatever works for you is good.

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Orgrim was kind of thought in terms of scalability for

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people who had, you know, thousands of notes with thousands

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of links inside of them. so perhaps it's not adapted to your

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note-taking style right now, but perhaps it's something to

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keep in mind, you know, it's many tools and you use them when

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you need to. Colin, if we can switch the questions, I'm

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switching to the second one.

NOTE Q: Do you use the Getting Things Done methodology as part of your Org workflow?

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Do you use the Getting Things

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Done methodology as part of your Org workflow? So there's an

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interesting thing about that. I started with Org first and

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then I heard about Getting Things Done, so I didn't exactly

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design my workflow with that in mind, but I sort of

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reinvented it, I would say, not really, but I do a lot of

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the similar things, but I don't have the different TODO

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states like...

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I don't know an example because I didn't really look into it

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that much, but it would be like NEXT isn't the next thing

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you're going to do. But I don't think I...

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where I just write what I need to do and then schedule it and

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then look at my agenda for the next thing. Yeah, I mean, part

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of the beauty of using Emacs, Org Mode or using a methodology

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like Getting Things Done is that I think you need to find room

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in the method or the tool for you to organically do what you

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want. And it's okay to not do everything in a Getting Things

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Done methodology. I know a lot of people take issue

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with the tickler file, where you're supposed to put stuff to

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review in the future. For instance, if you don't want

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to work on this particular topic right now in your life, you

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decide, oh, I'd like to revisit this topic maybe in six

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months. And then you have this tickler file, which has

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entries and folders for each month of the year. And when six

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months comes and you find yourself at the beginning of the

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next month, you open the file and you see, oh there's the task

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I left off for later. A lot of people don't like to do it this

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way, some people really like it, but part of the beauty of

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having tools which are very modular like Emacs and Org Mode

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allows you to have, well, you just adjust the method for

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something that works. And there's something to be garnered

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as well for applying these lessons to how you organize your

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life, not merely in front of a computer, but also how you

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manage your tasks elsewhere at school, iSchool or

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elsewhere.

NOTE Q: org-fc and org-drill are emacs org mode centric flash card solutions, have you looked into them?

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All right, moving to the next question. Org-fc and org-drill

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are Emacs Org Mode-centric flashcard solutions. Have you

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looked into them? I think I looked into Org-Drill, but I

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wanted to use Anki because of... I wanted to use it on my

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phone, but then I realized I had to pay for the app, and then I

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didn't want to use it on my phone anymore.

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but it's just something that I used before without work mode

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for a little bit. And then I liked it,

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but yeah, it works pretty well with Org mode. So I didn't

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find a reason to switch to one of those because like I might be

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not at a computer one day and have to learn something. Yeah,

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that's something that you call premature optimization.

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And if you continue as a software engineer at university,

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you'll get to hear plenty of this. But yes, Anki is also a tool

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that I've used a whole lot in my learning journeys, be it

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about languages, be it about literature, be it about

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whatever really, and it's a very good tool and I recommend

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people to look into it, especially since they've released a

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new algorithm to manage learning a little differently than

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the old one. If you're familiar with SuperMemo, I really

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invite you to look into the advancement

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in Anki in recent years.

NOTE Q: What do other students think about your approach - and what are they doing instead (if anything)? And your teachers - what do they think?

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Moving to another question, what do other students

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think about your approach and what are they doing instead,

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if anything? And your teachers, what do they think? So for

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other students they usually are just confused about what's

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going on when I show my computer because they know that I use

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Linux but they don't know what it is so they're just assuming

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everything on my computer is I'm either hacking or like

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doing some Linux thing and

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I don't really bother to explain it to them so that's kind

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But for I love it. See my see my prior videos. That's that's

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wonderful. Pardon me. Pardon me for breaking in, Daniel.

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But I just since I have, I want to say wonderful

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presentation. I love your spirit, your tone and great

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thought there.

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For my teachers, I think...

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because if I write an essay or something, I usually paste it

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in Google Docs. But recently, I got more confident, which is

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export to LaTeX, and I did that for my physics labs. My

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teacher was pretty satisfied with the results for the math

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formatting. So I think they don't really have a problem with

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it, where it's actually more convenient, maybe.

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That's really great to hear and if you continue at

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university, which I'm almost sure that you will, your

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professors, you'll be pretty much using the same tools as

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they are, so you'll find yourself in a like-minded crowd of

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people once you get to university. We are a little short on

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time because we need to move to the next talk in about one

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minute. There are still some questions and Daniel, I would

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invite you to stay and maybe answer them in a room so that we

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can gather as many of your answers as possible. But before we

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leave, I just want to give you the opportunity, if you have

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any last words, to share them with the crowd.

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Well, for the students who may be watching this, I hope that

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you give Emacs a try. And good luck if you decide to use

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something else because it's probably won't be as great.

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It's very good to be so young and to already be convinced that

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Emacs is the best thing. For some of us, it took us many

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decades to reach this conclusion, and I'm so happy

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to see young people. I used to be a teacher,

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by the way, so I used to teach people your age,

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but I'm so happy to see people your age

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interested in Emacs because it makes me hopeful that in the

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future we'll have people carrying the flame and standing on

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the shoulders of current people. So thank you so much,

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Daniel. We'll be seeing you soon. We wish you good luck with

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your studies. And for EmacsConf, we'll be moving to the next

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talk in five seconds. See you soon. And I want to reassure

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you, we'll post all the Q&A info when we do post this video.

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Yes. So Daniel, as I said,

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if you want to stick around a little more with

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Corwin to answer the questions, that's all fine.

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I'll be moving to the next room to get ready for the next

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talks. So thank you, Daniel. And I'll see you later.

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All right, the cops are gone. Wait, no, I'm just kidding. No,

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but if you'd like to walk through a few more of these

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questions, I'd be happy to record that. You're not

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obligated to do that. You could also, the pad's there. You

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could just type out your answers or whatever you prefer to

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do. I guess I can answer them still. Cool.

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So we're here.

NOTE Q: What was your biggest source of frustration/friction/confusion when getting started with Emacs?

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What was your biggest source of frustration, friction,

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confusion when getting started?

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I honestly don't really remember. It

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somehow just clicked one day and I figured it out.

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All right, it takes us pretty naturally to the next one.

NOTE Q: How did you come across Emacs? What got you into it?

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How did you come across Emacs? What got you into it? I could ask

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this question quite

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similar to how I stumbled into Linux, where I was... I heard

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of it before, but I saw screenshots of it

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or something on Reddit, and I was like, oh,

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that looks pretty cool, maybe I'll look into that.

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And then on YouTube, I would see videos

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about Doom Emacs, and then the Doomcasts video,

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I think that's what really got me into it.

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Okay, I did my best to capture that. So what's the situation

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with respect to the mobile use, if that's applicable? And

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Orgzly is,

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sorry, was it not Doomcast? Is it System Crafters?

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Sorry if I botched the note. Oh yeah, System Crafters was

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also one of the things I used for getting into Emacs from

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scratch. I'm sorry if my dog is barking.

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the, I'm not sure how to pronounce his name, but Protesilaos,

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I think that's how you say it. I always say Prot just to get me

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out of that problem for what it's worth. I'm not sure that I

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can say it properly either. Yeah, his videos were really

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great for getting started with each, each individual

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component of

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something like there's entire videos just

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about completion and about a tool called Embark. And like, I

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would just watch those videos

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while I was doing the dishes or something.

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and I would learn a lot from that.

NOTE Q: What the situation with respect to "mobile" use (if ever that's applicable)? (yes, Orgzly...using that?)

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Awesome. I love it. What about the mobile...

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sorry, did I get that question out there already? Oh, no.

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I don't use Emacs or any Org Mode things on my

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phone. I have an iPhone, unfortunately.

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But for org files, I couldn't really get it to sync over

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without using a paid app.

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And I didn't really look into it

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that much because I have a computer with me

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almost all the time.

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Usually I carry around a notebook. And if I really need to

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know something or remember it for later,

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I just write it down.

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I've seen people get started with e-ink tablets, and they

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sync it with SyncThing because it's Android, but I don't use

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that, so I can't really attest to how good it is.

NOTE Q: Has using emacs led to expanded interest in programming/computer science?

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So has using Emacs led you to an expanded interest in

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programming and computer science? Sorry if

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I could have got that out of the presentation.

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I think Emacs is what got me

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started with Lisp specifically.

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Otherwise, I probably would have not really looked into it

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that much, other than like  maybe dabbling in Scheme

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from the Structures and Interpretations of Computer

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Programs book. But I probably wouldn't have seen that if I

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hadn't discovered Emacs either so.

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I was already into programming

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before Emacs, and I had used VS Code for a little bit and then

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Vim. But I think I've done most of my programming

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inside of Emacs, in terms of lines of code written,

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projects made...

NOTE Q: How does interaction with others work in technical terms?

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So maybe we'd jump from there, right, to, you mentioned

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exporting notes, essays, and so on, handing them on to other

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people. How does interaction with others work in technical

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terms? We mostly find workflows centered around like

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Microsoft products, and that makes sense to me. I have a day

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job where I have to work with a bunch of Microsoft products,

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and I know the workflows for that. So how do you manage your

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kind of Emacs-y you know, workflows, um, you know, in terms of

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sharing with people. Yeah. So for sharing with like my

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teachers or something, I would, we use like Google at our

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school. So for, I'm very fortunate that I don't have to deal

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with Microsoft other than with a very niche situations in

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which I can just use LibreOffice and then convert to Doc X or

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something. I heard that chef. That's, that's how all my

00:17:35.720 --> 00:17:39.679
vendors, uh, my vendors all roll their eyes when they were,

00:17:39.680 --> 00:17:42.885
oh, you're a Microsoft shop. Yep. Heard.

00:17:42.886 --> 00:17:45.947
Then they're all Google shops too, in education.

00:17:45.948 --> 00:17:51.958
Great point. For Google, I just... If my teachers wanted

00:17:51.959 --> 00:17:53.125
a Google Doc or something,

00:17:53.126 --> 00:17:54.299
I usually just copy paste

00:17:54.300 --> 00:17:55.679
whatever I wrote in Emacs

00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:59.333
and then still keep it, anyway, as a side thing

00:17:59.334 --> 00:18:00.667
because I don't really trust the cloud

00:18:00.668 --> 00:18:02.875
that much in terms of using

00:18:02.876 --> 00:18:10.667
it for later if I wanted to look at it. But for that, I don't

00:18:10.668 --> 00:18:14.339
really have too much problems. Hopefully, I will find a way

00:18:14.340 --> 00:18:21.439
to figure it out when I get into university.

00:18:21.440 --> 00:18:26.679
Awesome. Okay, well, I know we did it once already, but since

00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:30.479
this will be the end of the video, let me just open the floor

00:18:30.480 --> 00:18:33.439
one more time for parting thoughts.

00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:41.719
I'm not sure that I have any. I mean, you said it pretty well,

00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:46.639
right? I hope my peers see this. I hope they realize other

00:18:46.640 --> 00:18:49.879
tools are kind of inferior from a gets things done

00:18:49.880 --> 00:18:54.639
standpoint. Saw your talk. Heard that message in this Q&A.

00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:58.159
I think you did a great job. You don't have to say more, but

00:18:58.160 --> 00:19:02.835
just offering you the chance. Thank you.

00:19:02.836 --> 00:19:03.916
Well, thank you, Daniel,

00:19:03.917 --> 00:19:07.439
and thanks to everybody watching this video

00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:09.838
during the conference or after it,

00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:12.159
and appreciate and look forward

00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:18.880
to your talks in the future, Daniel. Thank you.