path: root/2023/captions/emacsconf-2023-overlay--improving-compiler-diagnostics-with-overlays--jeff-trull--answers.vtt

WEBVTT


00:00:02.899 --> 00:00:03.399
[Speaker 0]: Out here or also you can continue discussing

00:00:06.200 --> 00:00:06.700
on IRC.

00:00:23.200 --> 00:00:23.320
So I see 2 questions coming in already on the

00:00:24.400 --> 00:00:24.619
pad. So the first question is,

00:00:26.759 --> 00:00:27.040
how did you draw the under braces and over

00:00:38.360 --> 00:00:38.559
braces? Sorry, Jeff, you're muted on the blue

00:00:38.559 --> 00:00:39.059
button.

00:00:43.340 --> 00:00:43.680
[Speaker 1]: I'm sorry for some reason I'm seeing

00:00:45.960 --> 00:00:46.420
everything twice. I'm hearing everything

00:00:48.420 --> 00:00:48.600
twice. So it's, it's about with about a 5

00:00:53.400 --> 00:00:53.900
[Speaker 0]: Probably my stream turned on

00:00:57.340 --> 00:00:57.620
[Speaker 1]: second delay. It's straight Oh,

00:01:03.820 --> 00:01:04.000
you're right Thank you so much I MPB is

00:01:07.340 --> 00:01:07.840
showing the the big blue button Okay,

00:01:09.060 --> 00:01:09.380
sorry everyone. Okay now.

00:01:12.180 --> 00:01:12.260
I'm together now Let's see How did I draw the

00:01:13.140 --> 00:01:13.640
over braces and under braces?

00:01:17.120 --> 00:01:17.620
LaTeX. That is a, that's a,

00:01:25.020 --> 00:01:25.380
yeah, and a SVG, I think,

00:01:29.160 --> 00:01:29.460
produced by LaTeX through a separate file.

00:01:31.960 --> 00:01:32.460
I tried to do like a LaTeX code block and

00:01:33.940 --> 00:01:34.160
didn't get around to it.

00:01:36.900 --> 00:01:37.260
Also, the code to produce it in TickSet was

00:01:39.800 --> 00:01:39.940
really, really long. So I didn't put it in

00:01:47.300 --> 00:01:47.540
[Speaker 0]: The next question is, you've got a nice

00:01:48.840 --> 00:01:49.340
sounding keyboard. What kind is it?

00:01:50.380 --> 00:01:50.600
[Speaker 1]: the notes. GARY ILLYES-CHAKRABARTYTT I'm so

00:01:55.960 --> 00:01:56.180
sorry. It is an Ergodox split keyboard for my

00:01:59.700 --> 00:02:00.180
wrists. Sorry about the noise.

00:02:01.020 --> 00:02:01.280
[Speaker 0]: Awesome. Yeah, no worries.

00:02:02.220 --> 00:02:02.440
I mean, I like to hear it.

00:02:03.900 --> 00:02:04.400
We like to hear it. I think a lot of us do.

00:02:07.080 --> 00:02:07.580
[Speaker 1]: Do we have anything on IRC?

00:02:15.880 --> 00:02:16.380
Let's see. Someone's asking for ligatures.

00:02:23.420 --> 00:02:23.860
Do you have any questions,

00:02:26.100 --> 00:02:26.600
Ben? Charles?

00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:35.440
[Speaker 0]: I see a bunch on the path that I can read for

00:02:36.980 --> 00:02:37.480
[Speaker 1]: Oh, yeah, please do.

00:02:39.960 --> 00:02:40.140
[Speaker 0]: now. Sure. So next question is,

00:02:41.580 --> 00:02:42.080
do you find that the invasive,

00:02:44.540 --> 00:02:44.680
quote unquote, 3-formatting interferes with

00:02:44.680 --> 00:02:45.180
navigation?

00:02:48.700 --> 00:02:49.200
[Speaker 1]: Yes, it does. That is true.

00:03:01.300 --> 00:03:01.800
Let me see. Yeah, it's weird.

00:03:04.120 --> 00:03:04.340
The good news is that,

00:03:06.260 --> 00:03:06.500
oh, you know what? The first thing I did,

00:03:07.600 --> 00:03:08.100
my first attempt at this,

00:03:11.140 --> 00:03:11.480
I actually made all of the incoming text

00:03:13.440 --> 00:03:13.660
invisible and just replaced it with my own

00:03:15.440 --> 00:03:15.940
text. And that was actually a lot worse.

00:03:21.420 --> 00:03:21.680
The more of the input that is removed or made

00:03:23.600 --> 00:03:23.960
invisible, the harder the navigation becomes.

00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:26.880
So the fact that now I'm just inserting line

00:03:29.440 --> 00:03:29.640
breaks and spaces makes it a lot easier.

00:03:30.540 --> 00:03:30.920
And I can still search.

00:03:34.600 --> 00:03:34.760
And when I get to the destination of the

00:03:38.300 --> 00:03:38.800
search, I'm still in proper normal text.

00:03:41.980 --> 00:03:42.160
So it got a little better by changing my

00:03:43.740 --> 00:03:43.940
strategy a bit, but it's still a little bit

00:03:50.180 --> 00:03:50.680
of a problem. Let's see.

00:03:51.720 --> 00:03:52.220
I'll go look at the etherpad.

00:03:55.080 --> 00:03:55.520
Where is it?

00:03:57.260 --> 00:03:57.440
[Speaker 0]: I can read the questions from etherpad if

00:04:00.660 --> 00:04:00.860
you'd like me to. And then If at any point

00:04:02.720 --> 00:04:03.180
you want to take the questions from IRC,

00:04:04.320 --> 00:04:04.820
then feel free to do that as well.

00:04:07.240 --> 00:04:07.600
[Speaker 1]: I found it. Can you show us the key bindings

00:04:08.940 --> 00:04:09.440
of your minor map for editing overlays?

00:04:15.860 --> 00:04:16.360
Well, I have a minor mode key map for

00:04:21.720 --> 00:04:22.220
increasing or decreasing the level of detail.

00:04:24.640 --> 00:04:25.140
And the key bindings are like,

00:04:31.840 --> 00:04:32.340
I can't remember what it is.

00:04:34.080 --> 00:04:34.200
If you go and you look at the source on

00:04:35.640 --> 00:04:36.140
GitHub, you can see it there.

00:04:37.600 --> 00:04:38.100
I forgot what I bound them to.

00:04:40.320 --> 00:04:40.820
Something that I'm allowed to do.

00:04:45.860 --> 00:04:46.220
They have restrictions on what key bindings

00:04:47.200 --> 00:04:47.700
you can make in minor modes.

00:04:49.300 --> 00:04:49.640
And I carefully followed the directions.

00:04:50.580 --> 00:04:50.820
I don't remember what it was.

00:04:54.220 --> 00:04:54.720
It's like Control-C-P or something like that.

00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:01.100
Or yeah. Sorry. Your examples were with C++

00:05:02.640 --> 00:05:03.140
if you experiment with any other languages.

00:05:07.460 --> 00:05:07.960
I haven't. I guess this is just a perennial

00:05:10.440 --> 00:05:10.940
pain point for C++ programmers.

00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:13.860
So that's kind of why my,

00:05:15.680 --> 00:05:16.000
and I am 1, and I guess that's why my focus

00:05:17.880 --> 00:05:18.080
was there. You probably have to rewrite some

00:05:20.520 --> 00:05:21.020
of the parsers to use something else.

00:05:24.060 --> 00:05:24.160
Would it be possible to include overlays in

00:05:25.080 --> 00:05:25.580
the source file itself?

00:05:30.860 --> 00:05:31.360
I actually don't understand this question.

00:05:33.120 --> 00:05:33.440
In the source file itself,

00:05:35.160 --> 00:05:35.660
there are language modes that do this.

00:05:41.580 --> 00:05:41.740
No, I'm not certain I understand that

00:05:43.520 --> 00:05:43.700
question. Maybe you could edit it a little

00:05:45.360 --> 00:05:45.860
bit more, overlays in the source file.

00:05:48.840 --> 00:05:49.340
What are your plans for TSP in the future?

00:05:54.560 --> 00:05:55.060
It's a little fragile.

00:06:00.020 --> 00:06:00.520
So it might be nice to investigate.

00:06:02.600 --> 00:06:02.920
I think you can get the compiler to output

00:06:04.120 --> 00:06:04.620
error messages in different formats,

00:06:07.320 --> 00:06:07.800
which might be more parsable or the parsing

00:06:08.360 --> 00:06:08.860
might be more maintainable.

00:06:10.280 --> 00:06:10.520
That might be an interesting thing to

00:06:15.460 --> 00:06:15.960
investigate. And the other thing is I have

00:06:19.200 --> 00:06:19.700
just 1 way of reformatting the output where

00:06:21.360 --> 00:06:21.820
everything on the same level is vertically

00:06:23.920 --> 00:06:24.160
aligned. But I think some people might want

00:06:26.920 --> 00:06:27.040
to make more use of the horizontal space on

00:06:30.920 --> 00:06:31.260
the screen and take the sort of sibling parts

00:06:34.860 --> 00:06:35.360
of the type and line them up straight across

00:06:39.140 --> 00:06:39.640
and take up a little bit less vertical space.

00:06:47.560 --> 00:06:48.040
Enriched mode. I don't know what enriched

00:06:51.240 --> 00:06:51.500
mode is. Interesting. Oh,

00:06:52.720 --> 00:06:53.220
what's my repository link?

00:06:56.400 --> 00:06:56.900
Let me get that then. I don't know how to

00:07:00.620 --> 00:07:01.120
format this properly, but it's just troll

00:07:03.820 --> 00:07:04.320
slash tspute. Yeah, it's on GitHub.

00:07:14.820 --> 00:07:15.160
Something like that. Let's see.

00:07:16.120 --> 00:07:16.620
This looks like the Etherpad.

00:07:19.640 --> 00:07:20.140
It looks like all the Etherpad questions.

00:07:22.120 --> 00:07:22.620
We have 1 here from Charles.

00:07:24.960 --> 00:07:25.120
Can overlays work as hypertext so you can

00:07:26.680 --> 00:07:27.180
link an error message back to the source?

00:07:30.720 --> 00:07:30.920
Yeah, actually, that's done by default in

00:07:32.680 --> 00:07:33.120
compilation mode. That's 1 of the features

00:07:36.160 --> 00:07:36.660
you get, which has been around for literally

00:07:41.280 --> 00:07:41.520
decades. Oh, yeah. Is it already there?

00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:42.740
Yes, it's already there.

00:07:45.960 --> 00:07:46.460
Let's see. Do we have anything on IRC?

00:07:56.680 --> 00:07:56.880
Let me see. OK, looks like it seems like

00:07:58.000 --> 00:07:58.480
we've run out of questions.

00:07:58.860 --> 00:07:59.360
Is that true?

00:08:04.440 --> 00:08:04.640
[Speaker 0]: Yeah, it seems so. It seems so,

00:08:06.820 --> 00:08:07.200
although we still have a couple more minutes,

00:08:09.000 --> 00:08:09.480
like maybe 3, 4 minutes on the stream.

00:08:13.780 --> 00:08:14.240
So yeah. And then, of course,

00:08:15.800 --> 00:08:16.020
once the stream does move on to the next

00:08:19.120 --> 00:08:19.440
talk. Folks are welcome to join Jeff here on

00:08:22.340 --> 00:08:22.500
BigBlueButton. If Jeff still has a few more

00:08:24.640 --> 00:08:24.960
minutes to just chat here or ask questions

00:08:25.800 --> 00:08:26.300
here, that works as well.

00:08:26.920 --> 00:08:27.240
[Speaker 1]: JEFF CROSSMAN-WILSONEY-PORTMAN Yeah,

00:08:29.640 --> 00:08:30.140
if anyone's excited about the tool.

00:08:38.460 --> 00:08:38.880
Are the notes are available online,

00:08:42.100 --> 00:08:42.360
right? I uploaded an org file that was my

00:08:43.700 --> 00:08:43.940
talk, and I actually included some

00:08:48.900 --> 00:08:49.300
references. Like at the end,

00:08:50.860 --> 00:08:51.360
there's some links and stuff like that.

00:08:54.620 --> 00:08:54.820
Whenever you see like a underlined thing in

00:08:56.840 --> 00:08:56.980
my presentation, it's like I was kind of

00:08:58.520 --> 00:08:59.020
thinking people would have access to the

00:09:00.920 --> 00:09:01.160
actual presentation itself so they could go

00:09:04.640 --> 00:09:05.140
and see what it was I was linking to some PDF

00:09:07.540 --> 00:09:08.000
somewhere. How annoying is this for multiple

00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:09.960
compilers? It's annoying,

00:09:15.620 --> 00:09:15.860
Ben. I basically have separate parsers for

00:09:18.600 --> 00:09:18.760
Clang and GCC, and I'm not supporting MSVC at

00:09:23.540 --> 00:09:23.940
the moment. So yeah, that's where I do worry

00:09:26.520 --> 00:09:26.680
about its fragility, about the way I'm kind

00:09:27.720 --> 00:09:28.220
of parsing these error messages,

00:09:29.340 --> 00:09:29.840
which are idiosyncratic.

00:09:38.440 --> 00:09:38.680
Oh, yeah, great. Thank you,

00:09:49.060 --> 00:09:49.220
Amin. That's good. Should just follow that

00:09:49.600 --> 00:09:50.100
link, I guess.

00:09:56.420 --> 00:09:56.720
[Speaker 0]: Well, yeah, it's so that you have to scroll

00:09:59.020 --> 00:09:59.380
down a little bit underneath the video

00:10:00.460 --> 00:10:00.960
embedding itself. There's timestamps.

00:10:01.880 --> 00:10:02.380
And then below the timestamps,

00:10:03.240 --> 00:10:03.740
I see a bunch of links,

00:10:06.140 --> 00:10:06.640
including 1 that says download.org.

00:10:09.800 --> 00:10:10.020
[Speaker 1]: Yeah, let's see what that is.

00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:13.320
Is that the right 1? Yeah,

00:10:14.780 --> 00:10:15.280
that's it. That's the 1.

00:10:19.280 --> 00:10:19.540
Yeah, you can also see all of my hacks to Org

00:10:20.740 --> 00:10:21.240
Present are in there as well.

00:10:25.760 --> 00:10:25.920
I followed the System Crafters thing and made

00:10:27.160 --> 00:10:27.660
a bunch of my own modifications.

00:10:33.120 --> 00:10:33.420
Org Present has this problem where every

00:10:35.760 --> 00:10:36.060
heading is a slide, which I don't like.

00:10:37.080 --> 00:10:37.580
I kind of want hierarchy.

00:10:41.040 --> 00:10:41.540
You know? Oh, no. Sorry.

00:10:43.440 --> 00:10:43.940
Every level 1 heading is a slide.

00:10:46.360 --> 00:10:46.720
And I kind of want hierarchy among the

00:10:51.440 --> 00:10:51.640
slides. And I had to sort of invent it in

00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:54.820
that system myself through navigation.

00:11:03.800 --> 00:11:04.300
It looks like things have quieted down.

00:11:09.520 --> 00:11:10.020
Shall we call it?

00:11:14.020 --> 00:11:14.120
[Speaker 0]: Yeah, sure. So yeah, thanks again for the

00:11:17.780 --> 00:11:18.120
great talk, Jeff. And also to the audience

00:11:18.960 --> 00:11:19.460
for questions and discussions.

00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:21.900
People are welcome to stay here on BBB if

00:11:24.060 --> 00:11:24.160
Jeff has time to continue the discussions and

00:11:25.320 --> 00:11:25.520
ask any questions they might have.

00:11:26.820 --> 00:11:27.320
Otherwise, yeah, we can wrap it.

00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:29.380
[Speaker 1]: Sure. Thank you so much.

00:11:30.400 --> 00:11:30.880
And I love this conference.

00:11:33.900 --> 00:11:34.120
I've been a happy attendee since like 2015 or

00:11:36.760 --> 00:11:37.120
something. So yeah, it's great.

00:11:37.760 --> 00:11:38.260
Thank you for your work.

00:11:41.040 --> 00:11:41.260
[Speaker 0]: Thank you. Cheers. I mean,

00:11:43.080 --> 00:11:43.260
in large part, thanks to awesome people like

00:11:44.280 --> 00:11:44.540
you who give these amazing talks.

00:11:45.420 --> 00:11:45.920
So Thank you as well.

00:14:30.260 --> 00:14:30.460
[Speaker 1]: You are currently the only person in this

00:14:30.460 --> 00:14:30.960
conference.

00:21:15.260 --> 00:21:15.760
You

00:21:37.760 --> 00:21:38.260
1

00:22:23.260 --> 00:22:23.760
1 1 1 1 2 1 2 1 2 1 1 3 4 1 2 4 1 1 3 4 1 1 2

00:22:28.100 --> 00:22:28.600
3 3 4 1 2 1

00:24:41.445 --> 00:24:41.945
You