WEBVTT
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[Speaker 0]: 2 seconds. And I think we are live.
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Hi Yuchen, how are you doing?
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[Speaker 1]: I'm gonna just walk off.
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I'm not sure if I... Yeah,
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I mean, brain not working well at this
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moment. How about you?
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[Speaker 2]: Well, mine is about to get fried because
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EmacsConf is a very taxing process and I can
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tell you we could have a race to know who's
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more more tired right now between you and
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myself but I guess we'll find out at the end
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[Speaker 1]: All right, sounds good.
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[Speaker 2]: of the Q&A. And thank you for...
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How late or how early I should say is it for
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you right now? It should be like 6am or
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[Speaker 1]: Thanks. It's 7.45 but I normally get up at
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like 8.30 or something.
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[Speaker 2]: something? Right, okay.
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Well, anyway, thank you for the sacrifice
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just to answer some of the questions.
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All right, so I'll be displaying the
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questions. I'll be, let me just maximize this
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on the stream so that people can read
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everything on my screen.
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So what I'm going to do,
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Yuchen, as usual, I'm going to start reading
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the questions on the pad.
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I'm going to ask Sasha to open the Q&A.
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Yes, it's already open.
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Cool. So if you want to join us,
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people, Feel free to click on the link on the
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talk or on IRC to join us on BBB and to ask
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your questions. Otherwise just leave them on
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the pad. Alright, Yuchen,
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starting with the first question.
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I like the idea of using org-mode to display
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data from the web. Are there many different
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packages that do not, I assume.
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I'm new to Emacs, so maybe this is obvious to
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everyone else.
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah, I think so. I mean...
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[Speaker 2]: Yeah, I think it's a little complicated to
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specify what is it to display data from the
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web. Just reading it like this,
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I'm reminded of Adam, Arthur Pappa,
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I mean, Code All Capture Web,
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which technically captures the web and allows
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you to embed it in the page,
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but is it really displaying data from the
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web? Are we implying live transmission?
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Do you see what I'm talking about?
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah, I suspect the question is asking,
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like, having Emacs as a client that's sort of
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getting data from the web and then displays
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in Emacs, like using API or using web script.
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So yeah, like the hreader package or a few
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packages mentioned in my talk.
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Yeah, that's a good question.
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I mean, I really don't know how many.
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So from my experience,
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maybe I use like 10, less than 10 packages
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that do these things. And among these
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packages, maybe it's half of them are org,
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[Speaker 2]: So you mean half of them are org-based?
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Is that what you said?
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[Speaker 1]: half of them don't. Yeah,
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but that's just based on the packages I use.
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I haven't done a survey about this.
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[Speaker 2]: I think it's okay, you don't need to have all
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the answers. I mean, you already demonstrate
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a lot of competence and you talk about all
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the things you approach with your particular
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setup, So you don't need to have all the
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answers. Okay. All right,
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moving on to the next question.
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Have you tried EAF, i.e.
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The Emacs application framework and its
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browser? If yes, what is your opinion about
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it?
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[Speaker 1]: Oh, I haven't tried it.
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I try to remember why I haven't tried it.
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It has a browser. I assume the browser
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executes JavaScript by default.
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I have to check. Emacs.daf
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slash daf browser.
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[Speaker 2]: It's also OK if you want to have a look later
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and you know whenever you want to report to
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the pad you know you write a little blurb
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah sure yeah so yeah I know about EAF but I
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haven't tried it.
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[Speaker 2]: about it. Okay well that's already an answer
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that's cool. We're gonna move on to a
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question that is a little bit off topic,
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but I've also been interested about your
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nickname on IRC. This is not really relevant
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to the talk, quoting the question,
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but I'm curious about your nickname.
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You have some connection to Norway.
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Your nick indicates an interest in the
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architectural style inspired by the
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decoration on Viking ships that was popular
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in the early 20th century because
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Dragonsteel, I assume in Norwegian,
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is Dragon style. Are you familiar with this?
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah, it's just my favorite architecture
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style, I think. I mean,
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I lived in Sweden for like 2,
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1 half years and yeah I went to Norway once
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and I saw like this church in Lofoten Island,
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[Speaker 0]: was amazing. In Luton Island,
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on Luton Island. Right.
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[Speaker 1]: on Lofoten Island. Yeah it Yeah,
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it was amazing. So, yeah,
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that's exactly why I chose that as my
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nickname, because it's my favorite
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architecture style.
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[Speaker 2]: Okay, well, that was a very astute remark by
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the viewers, so I hope you feel validated in
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[Speaker 0]: assumptions. Moving on
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[Speaker 2]: your to another question.
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Yuchen, do you have any thoughts about Nixed,
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about its name, its approach,
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its relevance? About Nixed,
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the browser, N-Y-X-T. Oh,
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Nixed.
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[Speaker 1]: About what? Yeah, I have tried it.
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Well, I mean, it's not Emacs.
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It's kind of similar. I think it tries to do
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something similar to Emacs,
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but The problem with Nix is that very early
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on I encountered an issue with keybinding.
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So the first thing I want to do is to make
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all its keybindings emax-y.
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So that's obviously...
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So what was the problem?
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So yeah, I couldn't even do that.
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I thought, I was expecting that it could...
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There shouldn't be any issues with setting up
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whatever key binding you want.
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So I, the, the issue was that when I tried to
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do when I tried to bind Ctrl S Ctrl R to the
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prompt going up and down,
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so I use I was I complete and I'm used to
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like the control S and control R to go,
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to cycle through the selections.
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And so I want it the same in next in its
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prompt like when, for example,
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typing a URL and get completion from history.
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But it has a conflict with the...
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And also, I try to bind the hint.
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So when I want to follow a link,
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So I press a hint key and then like all these
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links are highlighted with like little
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letters that I can like choose which 1 I want
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which link I want to follow.
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So I try to bind that 1 to J sort of like
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Control C, Control J, or mode.
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But apparently there's a conflict here.
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So when I do both these prompt mode binding
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and the document mode binding,
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Yeah, the prompt no longer works.
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And I reported the bug to Nixt.
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And yeah, and there was response but there
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are so many bugs there,
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and I don't think that bug is very high
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priority. So yeah, I basically stopped trying
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that because key mining is very important to
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[Speaker 2]: Right, but, sorry, please finish.
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[Speaker 1]: me. Yeah, so I mean, yeah,
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without key bindings I can't like,
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I won't. So, okay, I feel this is a very
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basic functionality. I'm kind of reluctant to
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[Speaker 2]: Without key bindings, they are.
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[Speaker 1]: continue trying what These are pieces.
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[Speaker 2]: It reminds me of 2 points.
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So yesterday with Stefan we were talking
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about sane defaults and when he was sleeping
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today we talked about it again with a
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speaker. We did the mentor talk.
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Feel free to re-watch it afterwards.
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But it's funny how, you know,
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regardless of how big the package actually
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is, they always provide some kind of sane
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default and with Nixed,
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obviously, it's built with a Vim mentality
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and modality of key bindings.
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And for us, we are more used to the Emacs way
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of doing things. It's a complete blocker.
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No matter how great the pieces of
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functionality behind Nixed are,
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just the fact that UX-wise we cannot get into
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it or we cannot have it behave nicely with
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what we do. It's a massive block that is
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preventing appropriation of such tools.
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So it might seem very basic to bounce a
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package at the level of key bindings but
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that's what we all do.
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah, I totally agree.
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[Speaker 2]: Right, if I can just interrupt,
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we have about 2 more minutes of questions and
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I see people are writing more questions.
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Did you want to add something,
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Yucheng? On what we're saying?
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[Speaker 1]: No, no, no, Let's continue.
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[Speaker 2]: had plenty of time. Okay,
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I'm going to ask you to be quick about this
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1. I'm going to read the question,
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which is slightly long,
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and you're going to have about 30 seconds to
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answer it. Do you feel capable of this?
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[Speaker 1]: I thought we Yeah, let's try it.
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[Speaker 2]: Let's try it. At least try it.
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Okay, so quoting, I find the JavaScript trap
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almost impossible to avoid since I like to
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buy used stuff online and use my online bank.
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How do you deal with a JavaScript trap?
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I use NoScript and compromise on a few things
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I really feel I cannot live without.
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EWW is nice for a lot of things,
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especially with R for less noise,
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but I need Firefox for those GS and trapped
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pages. So do you have a quick answer to this?
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[Speaker 1]: Yeah, I don't have a good answer,
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but I have a quick answer.
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So I use VPN and like a more,
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what do you call it, move out the Swedish VPN
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browser, move out browser.
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Yeah, so I unfortunately I have to use
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JavaScript in these cases as well,
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but I try to minimize the use of these
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things.
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[Speaker 2]: How long do you think it will take for us to
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save the world with Emacs,
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or save the web at least?
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5 years, 10 years, maybe a little less than
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this?
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[Speaker 1]: Well I think it's, unfortunately it's
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probably independent of Emacs,
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like it will only be saved when,
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like it's saved on like the normal,
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the more popular browsers like Firefox.
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I have no clue how long it will take for,
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I don't know, for example,
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Tala to pick up so that you can buy things
00:12:30.020 --> 00:12:30.520
without running JavaScript.
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[Speaker 2]: Right. Well, I guess we'll have to cross our
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fingers then for Firefox to save the world.
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All right Yuchen, we're about out of time,
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we're moving on to the next talk in 20
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seconds. Thank you so much for your
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presentation and for waking up early and
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answering the question,
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and I can tell you, you were very alert and
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definitely more energetic than I was.
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All right, see you later.
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[Speaker 1]: Thank you. See you.
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[Speaker 2]: Bye. And we go to the next talk right now.
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[Speaker 0]: You are currently
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you
