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+WEBVTT
+
+00:00.000 --> 00:09.660
+About five seconds until we go live.
+
+00:09.660 --> 00:10.660
+And we are live!
+
+00:10.660 --> 00:11.660
+Hello again!
+
+00:11.660 --> 00:15.580
+It's the first time you're seeing me today, and hopefully you're still laughing from
+
+00:15.580 --> 00:18.940
+the little joke Carl had at the end of his talk.
+
+00:18.940 --> 00:20.940
+Hi Carl, how are you doing?
+
+00:20.940 --> 00:26.260
+I'm fine thanks, how are you doing?
+
+00:26.260 --> 00:29.700
+I'm doing pretty fine, but I am currently struggling to make my windows slightly larger
+
+00:29.700 --> 00:31.240
+because what am I doing?
+
+00:31.240 --> 00:34.920
+Okay, okay, I think people can see me relatively well right now.
+
+00:34.920 --> 00:38.120
+Yeah, I am doing well, and thank you for the joke.
+
+00:38.120 --> 00:42.960
+It feels like when I see people wearing suits during a BBB presentation, or sorry, not a
+
+00:42.960 --> 00:47.880
+BBB presentation, an EmacsConc presentation, I feel like it's a reply to my own style and
+
+00:47.880 --> 00:48.880
+I feel attacked.
+
+00:48.880 --> 00:53.200
+But I will just confirm, how do I do this without making too much of a fool, I will
+
+00:53.200 --> 01:00.260
+lower my standing desk, and you can see that I am actually wearing trousers.
+
+01:00.260 --> 01:04.000
+So yes, I am wearing socks and sandals because it's really cold right now and it's very comfortable
+
+01:04.000 --> 01:05.000
+as well.
+
+01:05.000 --> 01:11.580
+Don't ask me on this, but I am technically more dressed than you are.
+
+01:11.580 --> 01:17.580
+Well this was a lederhose, actually a quite nice lederhose, which you wear for specific
+
+01:17.580 --> 01:18.580
+occasions.
+
+01:18.580 --> 01:23.440
+It's not considered as something special.
+
+01:23.440 --> 01:28.320
+No, definitely, but it is looking a little bit odd to my French style.
+
+01:28.320 --> 01:32.400
+Yeah, especially the combination, yes, you're right.
+
+01:32.400 --> 01:36.680
+Right, we could be talking about hours for this, but I suppose people are not actually
+
+01:36.680 --> 01:39.720
+here to hear us talk about this, but about you talk.
+
+01:39.720 --> 01:44.720
+I'm not going to make the affront of asking if you've got the pad open, considering that
+
+01:44.720 --> 01:48.520
+you have been managing the pad and helping us manage the pad for what, three years now,
+
+01:48.520 --> 01:49.520
+or something?
+
+01:49.520 --> 01:57.240
+Yeah, but this year, actually, it's doing great without my help, so yeah.
+
+01:57.240 --> 02:00.100
+Actually there are already two answers.
+
+02:00.100 --> 02:04.360
+Somebody was nice enough to copy my answers from the IRC to here.
+
+02:04.360 --> 02:10.440
+Can you filter out blocked tasks on stuff like your agenda, on specific agenda view,
+
+02:10.440 --> 02:14.920
+when you want to know what you can do next?
+
+02:14.920 --> 02:20.120
+That's a tricky question.
+
+02:20.120 --> 02:25.280
+The blocked tasks are never shown on the agenda by default.
+
+02:25.280 --> 02:36.200
+Whenever there is no scheduled timestamp attached to a heading, it's not visible on my agenda.
+
+02:36.200 --> 02:43.400
+If you use the dependencies, as I described it in the demo, you will see that the scheduled
+
+02:43.400 --> 02:51.520
+timestamp, or date stamp, is only added when the previous one is marked as done, or canceled.
+
+02:51.520 --> 02:57.480
+So therefore, blocked tasks are never shown on the agenda by default, if you use it in
+
+02:57.480 --> 03:01.520
+this, in that way.
+
+03:01.520 --> 03:06.720
+The functionality seems quite nice, but the markup seems pretty heavy in the property
+
+03:06.720 --> 03:07.720
+drawers.
+
+03:07.720 --> 03:17.320
+Do you ever have any issues having so much meta-level information?
+
+03:17.320 --> 03:27.960
+No, as long as I don't have to type it manually, I don't see any issue at all, so far.
+
+03:27.960 --> 03:35.000
+Because I tend to have very, rather large org-mode files in any way.
+
+03:35.000 --> 03:41.840
+So far, I haven't thought of, oh my gosh, this is so bloated, I need to simplify it.
+
+03:41.840 --> 03:45.320
+Not yet.
+
+03:45.320 --> 03:52.360
+Looking for the IRC, if there is something going on.
+
+03:52.360 --> 03:56.120
+If not, we'll be able to, because this is the showdown people were waiting.
+
+03:56.120 --> 04:02.720
+Two years ago, you wrote an article about Algrom not being good, and I'm being polite.
+
+04:02.720 --> 04:05.160
+We need to fight this out right now.
+
+04:05.160 --> 04:07.000
+Yeah, sure.
+
+04:07.000 --> 04:18.120
+Actually, I do think that Zettelkasten methods are interesting, but so far, I haven't seen
+
+04:18.120 --> 04:21.400
+much use in my personal use.
+
+04:21.400 --> 04:26.960
+But I can imagine that, for example, if you're working on a PhD thesis, or you're studying
+
+04:26.960 --> 04:31.780
+in some research field and so forth, it's quite handy.
+
+04:31.780 --> 04:40.800
+The only thing my concept so far doesn't have what the usual Zettelkasten methods do provide
+
+04:40.800 --> 04:46.960
+is this visual navigation method, which I would not use anyway.
+
+04:46.960 --> 04:53.960
+So I don't see any purpose at all for Zettelkasten methods for my personal use cases, as long
+
+04:53.960 --> 05:01.160
+as I don't think that this visual navigation would be very handy in my case.
+
+05:01.160 --> 05:07.880
+I'm very happy with the bidirectional links, because they get me from A to B, and I can
+
+05:07.880 --> 05:12.700
+connect ideas and headings and tasks and whatnot.
+
+05:12.700 --> 05:20.440
+So this is basically the most important part of Zettelkasten method from my perspective.
+
+05:20.440 --> 05:26.880
+And this is what these bidirectional links and dependencies provide for me in my personal
+
+05:26.880 --> 05:27.880
+setup.
+
+05:27.880 --> 05:34.080
+Yeah, and I was taking a jab at it, because even you, with your own article, you were
+
+05:34.080 --> 05:41.080
+saying how, you know, it's a title to grab attention, but actually you had a lot of things
+
+05:41.080 --> 05:42.080
+Yeah, it was trick-based.
+
+05:42.080 --> 05:48.200
+Yeah, I didn't want to say the word, you know, I'm trying to be, like, I didn't read the
+
+05:48.200 --> 05:51.960
+actual title that should title the article.
+
+05:51.960 --> 05:55.760
+But yeah, I think you were also interested in what we were discussing yesterday.
+
+05:55.760 --> 06:00.240
+I can't remember which talk, because we had a number of org talks, but when I was discussing
+
+06:00.240 --> 06:05.680
+in one of the Q&A the concept of a slip box for multiple peoples, you seemed to be interested
+
+06:05.680 --> 06:07.800
+in this topic as well.
+
+06:07.800 --> 06:08.800
+Yes.
+
+06:08.800 --> 06:15.440
+Yeah, my personal interest is in personal information management, but collaborative
+
+06:15.440 --> 06:20.540
+information management is of course a very related and important part, and I have some
+
+06:20.540 --> 06:27.240
+background by writing a PhD thesis on organizing information and files and whatnot, and therefore
+
+06:27.240 --> 06:37.460
+I'm interested in the ideas how to make a collaborative, let's say, something that might
+
+06:37.460 --> 06:42.200
+actually work within a work group or even larger.
+
+06:42.200 --> 06:49.960
+There are some things that overlap between personal information management and collaborative,
+
+06:49.960 --> 07:01.680
+for example, I'm sure you know the vocabulary problem, where people do have different mental
+
+07:01.680 --> 07:08.520
+models of the same stuff, so therefore finding one common phrase or one common word is a
+
+07:08.520 --> 07:15.200
+difficult task to do, and you get these kind of troubles all over the place if you go into
+
+07:15.200 --> 07:16.680
+that direction.
+
+07:16.680 --> 07:23.560
+Yeah, this is why I think just like a lot of software solutions, they need to be backed
+
+07:23.560 --> 07:25.720
+up by strong methodology on the side.
+
+07:25.720 --> 07:30.080
+It feels like it's always a balance when you have the tools that are helping you enable
+
+07:30.080 --> 07:39.160
+something like Emacs, like Org, like Zorcast, EL, Orgrom, or any kind of the, I don't want
+
+07:39.160 --> 07:44.040
+to say Orgrom clone, it's like Dark Souls, when everything becomes a Dark Souls clone,
+
+07:44.040 --> 07:50.840
+that's not the point, we have Zorcast and modes in Emacs that allow you to do this no-taking,
+
+07:50.840 --> 07:51.840
+so that's the tools.
+
+07:51.840 --> 07:55.960
+And then you have the methods on the other end, which are about how do you use those
+
+07:55.960 --> 08:00.800
+tools to work with multiple people, we're only talking about collective sandbox here.
+
+08:00.800 --> 08:06.760
+And yeah, there is obviously the vocabulary discussion, the point that Carl just mentioned,
+
+08:06.760 --> 08:11.200
+there are some solutions methodologically, like you can have a taxonomy of all the words
+
+08:11.200 --> 08:16.760
+you're using, if you have a list of patterns, for instance, it's good to fix the language
+
+08:16.760 --> 08:21.600
+within a file, so that you can have something that people can read.
+
+08:21.600 --> 08:27.840
+It's kind of like, you have dictionaries, obviously, but it reminds me of some very
+
+08:27.840 --> 08:32.720
+specific dictionaries, like the hacker dictionary, when you have a lot of entries, where people
+
+08:32.720 --> 08:38.200
+can learn the lingua, how to use the internet, how to chat on IOC, stuff like this, it feels
+
+08:38.200 --> 08:45.320
+like a group sandbox is always going to be oriented towards solving a particular project,
+
+08:45.320 --> 08:49.600
+I think, and I think taxonomy and vocabulary would be very important to have.
+
+08:49.600 --> 08:54.280
+Anyway, I don't want to take too much, this is a very interesting topic, obviously, you
+
+08:54.280 --> 09:00.080
+wrote a PhD on it, and I wrote software on it, and you've wrote software on it as well,
+
+09:00.080 --> 09:06.640
+but we should probably talk about this later, at least, but maybe come up with something
+
+09:06.640 --> 09:08.640
+to present in a year or so.
+
+09:08.640 --> 09:09.640
+Okay.
+
+09:09.640 --> 09:17.480
+So, somebody wrote the BBB is not open yet, I don't know if it's on purpose or not.
+
+09:17.480 --> 09:18.480
+I'll do this now.
+
+09:18.480 --> 09:21.640
+You'll see me whisper, you'll see something very fancy, look at me, I'm going to press
+
+09:21.640 --> 09:24.600
+the button, you're going to see something appear at the bottom to talk to production,
+
+09:24.600 --> 09:30.440
+this is the thing that I've developed since yesterday, it's amazing, wasn't it?
+
+09:30.440 --> 09:32.840
+This was technology, right there.
+
+09:32.840 --> 09:37.320
+So yes, the BBB will be open in about 30 seconds to one minute.
+
+09:37.320 --> 09:42.080
+And people, it's the first one of the day, so I'll do the reminder.
+
+09:42.080 --> 09:48.440
+In order to join us in a room right now, where I'm talking with Carl, you will need to go
+
+09:48.440 --> 09:56.280
+to the talk page, so you can find all the talks on emaskov.org-2022.
+
+09:56.280 --> 10:02.000
+Then you find the talk by Carl Voigt, you can look for his name, you click on the link
+
+10:02.000 --> 10:06.800
+over there and at the top you will have a link to the BBB room in which we are currently. Also
+
+10:06.800 --> 10:13.840
+if you're on IRC you will just have gotten a notification about joining the room. So in the
+
+10:13.840 --> 10:18.400
+meantime Carl, how about we answer some of the new questions that you have on the pad whilst people
+
+10:18.400 --> 10:29.680
+get warmed up. Sure. So the next one, does this change how you use to-do keywords next to do
+
+10:29.680 --> 10:40.880
+blocked? Avoiding some or starting to use others? No. I don't see any connection. And my keywords
+
+10:40.880 --> 10:56.160
+are next, oops, next, started, waiting, done, cancelled. That's basically it if you're interested.
+
+10:56.160 --> 11:02.800
+But my configuration is online anyway. I can paste the link later. And yes, I can paste the link to
+
+11:02.800 --> 11:12.880
+my thesis as well as ask on the IRC. Carl, if you don't mind, I do have a quick question because
+
+11:12.880 --> 11:19.360
+I'm going to forget otherwise. We have someone in IRC asking you, is your PhD published? I'm not a
+
+11:19.360 --> 11:26.560
+PhD but your thesis is published. Yes, of course. Everything of my PhD is public including the actual
+
+11:26.560 --> 11:33.760
+research work, the hard figures of the user experiments and the derived functions, everything
+
+11:33.760 --> 11:41.920
+of course. The later one actually should be also in org mode so 100% reproducible which was very
+
+11:41.920 --> 11:47.200
+important to me. Would you have a link, so maybe not right now but in the pad, could you include a
+
+11:47.200 --> 11:53.760
+link later on? I've already wrote down a question for that on my own so that I don't forget to
+
+11:53.760 --> 11:58.240
+answer it afterwards. Okay, amazing. Thank you. You can continue with the questions. We also have
+
+11:58.240 --> 12:02.400
+people joining on. I see microphones now and some of the people joining on BBB so I'm excited. I'm
+
+12:02.400 --> 12:07.680
+getting ready for your questions. But in the meantime, Carl, feel free to go. I'm answering
+
+12:07.680 --> 12:15.200
+all the questions in the pad anyway so if somebody is asking something in the BBB, I'm open to it.
+
+12:15.200 --> 12:21.360
+Right, there is just one other thing I need to say. We need to move with the next talk in about
+
+12:21.360 --> 12:27.440
+eight minutes. So, Carl, if you could maybe not rush but answer fairly quickly the last questions
+
+12:27.440 --> 12:35.680
+on the pad, then we can move on to live Q&A inside BBB. Sure. OrgBrain has stuff like parent links
+
+12:35.680 --> 12:40.560
+and directional links, sibling links, and if org.roam.else had nothing else interesting,
+
+12:40.560 --> 12:48.560
+what about, like, the previous stuff? I'm going to be honest, I'm not sure what the previous stuff
+
+12:48.560 --> 12:59.360
+was either. So, referring to side window, where it's not only the linked heading, so not only the
+
+12:59.360 --> 13:08.240
+link is shown but actually some heading title and short contents below it. So, that's very handy
+
+13:08.240 --> 13:13.520
+when you are looking, like, or is it relevant, or it's not relevant.
+
+13:16.720 --> 13:25.040
+To me, it's not relevant at the moment. I don't have the requirement for specific link types
+
+13:25.760 --> 13:32.080
+or directions. I like how, Carl, you feel obligated to write and speak at the same time.
+
+13:32.080 --> 13:36.240
+Like, you can let go of your responsibility as the pad. We have another volunteer helping you
+
+13:36.240 --> 13:42.000
+with the pad right now, so don't worry about it. Perfect. So, do you find that the links are fragile,
+
+13:42.000 --> 13:50.080
+hard to maintain? No, not at all. The only thing that I have to remark here is probably that
+
+13:50.080 --> 13:58.640
+sometimes I rename the links when the heading actually was renamed afterward and the link name
+
+13:58.640 --> 14:06.640
+isn't reflecting the actual heading. Then I do a quick search and replace all of my Org Mode files,
+
+14:06.640 --> 14:13.840
+but that's basically it. So, no, I really love the bi-directional and uni-directional links,
+
+14:14.640 --> 14:23.440
+and it doesn't give me any burden to maintain them. Would it be of interest to, like, make auto
+
+14:23.440 --> 14:35.840
+description for links in Org? You have an ID, you don't have any description, but then
+
+14:35.840 --> 14:44.240
+description is generated automatically. My IDs are auto-generated and they are generated from
+
+14:44.240 --> 14:50.880
+the heading title, so usually my links are pretty much self-explanatory.
+
+14:50.880 --> 14:58.640
+Oh, so what you're referring to is that you have a link, then you rename the linked heading,
+
+14:58.640 --> 15:05.440
+and then you change the link ID. Oh yeah, that's true. Links are not synchronized with their
+
+15:05.440 --> 15:15.120
+headings once they are generated, but usually a heading title is not changed that often by me,
+
+15:15.120 --> 15:24.960
+so this is not a really important problem in my use cases. PhD thesis unlinked later.
+
+15:24.960 --> 15:33.440
+Why not Org UUIDs for IDs and the Preferences human-readable ones? Yeah, I hate UUIDs because
+
+15:33.440 --> 15:42.640
+they tell me nothing at all, so I want to get an idea to what I'm linking to. Therefore, I've got
+
+15:42.640 --> 15:52.800
+rid of all UUIDs in my setup and I prefer something that gives me as a user an idea of
+
+15:52.800 --> 16:04.000
+what's happening when I open up this link. Sorry, have you been able to hear me? Is it
+
+16:04.000 --> 16:10.000
+the first OTS mic of the conference? Wow, this is amazing. I was mispressing the button, I think.
+
+16:10.000 --> 16:14.320
+I apologize humbly, deeply, and sincerely about the hot mic. No problem.
+
+16:19.360 --> 16:26.640
+Do you have or use anything for what links here to this heading in a more occurred grep style
+
+16:26.640 --> 16:36.560
+buffer and auto? No, not yet. I'm not using that, but I may be able to what links to here
+
+16:36.560 --> 16:42.480
+by looking for the ID. All the heading IDs start with a date stamp and then a
+
+16:43.440 --> 16:52.160
+string which is made up from the heading title. If I want to see what links to this specific heading
+
+16:52.160 --> 17:01.200
+without having backlinks, I usually use org occur within the buffer and get the result right away.
+
+17:01.200 --> 17:08.640
+All right, I'm just going to give you, I have the bad role here, I have to be the man with
+
+17:08.640 --> 17:14.320
+the watch telling you that we have about three minutes left in this talk and afterwards we'll
+
+17:14.320 --> 17:18.240
+need to move on to the next one. So you have about two minutes. Carla, I didn't ask you if
+
+17:18.240 --> 17:22.640
+you had anything else to add over your talk. I wish we had more time to discuss because it's
+
+17:22.640 --> 17:26.400
+a very interesting topic, but sadly we will have to get going with the next talk in two minutes.
+
+17:26.400 --> 17:33.280
+So the next two minutes are yours. I continue answering questions on the
+
+17:33.280 --> 17:46.720
+pad of course and you'll see me around on the IRC. I'm still around in IRC. I will answer all
+
+17:46.720 --> 17:54.400
+the questions on the pad even after we continue and everybody who wants to get in touch and talk
+
+17:54.400 --> 18:01.920
+about this stuff may find me on the internet. Sure, there is still the nebulous concept.
+
+18:01.920 --> 18:07.520
+Every Microsoft says we should have a meeting room for maintainers or for people well invested
+
+18:07.520 --> 18:14.000
+into org and melpa stuff and package writing because it feels like if we have so many ideas
+
+18:14.640 --> 18:18.640
+and so far the only person who's been able to implement every single idea they have is
+
+18:18.640 --> 18:25.600
+Alfa Papa because I have no idea how they do it. That's actually a group of people I think.
+
+18:26.640 --> 18:33.440
+Yes, we need to check if Alfa Papa appeared in two different rooms at the same time. I need to
+
+18:33.440 --> 18:42.000
+confirm this for my own sanity. But yeah, barring Adam from being able to do this, we have so many
+
+18:42.000 --> 18:46.400
+ideas and it feels like if we were talking about them with other people we might be able to implement.
+
+18:46.400 --> 18:49.760
+I've been asking about the cloning machine so maybe Alfa Papa got one.
+
+18:51.200 --> 18:56.560
+Yeah, well anyway I'm sorry for cutting the conversation a little short but we will have
+
+18:56.560 --> 19:02.480
+to get started with the next talk. So thank you so much Karl for taking the time first to send a
+
+19:02.480 --> 19:07.440
+recording to us for answering questions now and also for being a volunteer for eMaximum. Thank
+
+19:07.440 --> 19:14.000
+you so much for all of those three things. Oh, you're welcome. We will probably see you next
+
+19:14.000 --> 19:20.160
+year. I am now definitely set on expecting a Cardboard talk every year and you will have to
+
+19:20.160 --> 19:25.600
+top it next year. I'm not sure what you will find to make the end funny but you have set the bar
+
+19:25.600 --> 19:31.840
+quite high and you need to go even higher this time. Next time without the Leda Jose oil.
+
+19:33.280 --> 19:38.240
+As long as you don't show up, put more clothes, not fewer garments, please.
+
+19:38.240 --> 19:45.520
+We will have to get started with the next talk. Thank you so much Karl. No, I'm sorry. We need to
+
+19:45.520 --> 19:49.760
+get moving to the next talk. I'll be closing the BBB room and we'll start with the next talk at
+
+19:49.760 --> 19:58.160
+the top of the minute in 30 seconds. Bye-bye everyone. Bye. All right, we are not live anymore.
+
+19:58.160 --> 20:01.920
+Thank you so much Karl. I have to get going. We need to make sure everything works now.
+
+20:01.920 --> 20:07.840
+Sure. Bye. Bye-bye.
+