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authorSacha Chua <sacha@sachachua.com>2024-12-24 10:31:26 -0500
committerSacha Chua <sacha@sachachua.com>2024-12-24 10:31:26 -0500
commit436f702956aad327f9039ae842d7c524ec4cbf72 (patch)
tree0784155569dfc98374ff863490ee0ce490250920 /2024/captions
parent82f130314ca10bd1e8fad7eb628b8c4e7aceb510 (diff)
downloademacsconf-wiki-436f702956aad327f9039ae842d7c524ec4cbf72.tar.xz
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WEBVTT
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... Org mode and kind of note taking. And that meant that it wasn't
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+00:00:06.040 --> 00:00:10.679
too difficult to get started with. But when I started more on
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the coding side, because I'm a software engineer, you know,
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+00:00:14.960 --> 00:00:20.679
on the day job. That kind of got me to think that the colors and
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+00:00:20.680 --> 00:00:26.479
how themes look, how Emacs looks, was affecting. And that's
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+00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:30.719
how it kind of came to picture. So I could have kind of gone
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+00:00:30.720 --> 00:00:34.919
into a little bit more coding side of things, but I didn't
-00:29.073 --> 00:36.917
+00:00:34.920 --> 00:00:38.319
want to stress too much on the talk. So that's why I kind of
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+00:00:38.320 --> 00:00:43.439
stuck to a very small bits of Org Mode and Elisp. And yeah, I
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+00:00:43.440 --> 00:00:48.159
think that's how it came about. Yeah, but that's perfectly
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+00:00:48.160 --> 00:00:52.119
fine. That's one of the chief reasons why we have two tracks
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+00:00:52.120 --> 00:00:54.799
for Emacs content. We've had those for the last four years, I
-00:52.798 --> 00:55.059
+00:00:54.800 --> 00:00:57.279
think. It's because we have a general track, which is more
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+00:00:57.280 --> 00:00:59.239
geared towards people who want a general... well,
-00:55.119 --> 01:05.442
+00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:01.799
generally people who are highly interested into org mode
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+00:01:01.800 --> 00:01:03.999
and not necessarily into coding, but just to whet their
-00:55.119 --> 01:05.442
+00:01:04.000 --> 00:01:08.399
appetite to what can be done. And on the DevTrack, we have,
-01:06.082 --> 01:12.986
+00:01:08.400 --> 00:01:11.519
well, this year we have talked about Rust and about other
-01:06.082 --> 01:12.986
+00:01:11.520 --> 00:01:13.559
fancy things that people can do with Emacs. But, you know,
-01:13.006 --> 01:15.768
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I'm also a software engineer, you know, we do this all the
-01:13.006 --> 01:15.768
+00:01:15.560 --> 00:01:18.079
time. Sometimes it's just fine to just chat about colors and
-01:15.808 --> 01:21.751
+00:01:18.080 --> 00:01:20.959
just the results of what we develop rather than how the
-01:15.808 --> 01:21.751
+00:01:20.960 --> 00:01:24.839
sausage is made. So that's completely fine too. I'm not sure
NOTE Why colour?
-01:23.733 --> 01:32.618
+00:01:24.840 --> 00:01:28.879
if you mentioned it in your presentation, but why color, out
-01:23.733 --> 01:32.618
+00:01:28.880 --> 00:01:31.479
of all the things you could be ricing on your setup, why were
-01:23.733 --> 01:32.618
+00:01:31.480 --> 00:01:37.559
you so interested about colors? I think it was just that
-01:34.870 --> 01:41.176
+00:01:37.560 --> 00:01:40.239
mainly that I had to do a lot of context switch between
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+00:01:40.240 --> 00:01:44.119
different languages. Elisp is not the one because Elisp is
-01:41.576 --> 01:46.600
+00:01:44.120 --> 00:01:48.079
something that I would do for Emacs editing. But for day job,
-01:47.061 --> 01:52.385
+00:01:48.080 --> 00:01:52.999
I had to use mainly Go as I work with Kubernetes quite a bit. So
-01:52.525 --> 01:57.109
+00:01:53.000 --> 00:01:58.119
Go and also web languages like TypeScript, JavaScript, you
-01:58.090 --> 02:13.642
+00:01:58.120 --> 00:02:01.519
know, those languages, where I felt that whenever I was
-01:58.090 --> 02:13.642
+00:02:01.520 --> 00:02:05.359
switching context to a different language, I felt that it's
-01:58.090 --> 02:13.642
+00:02:05.360 --> 00:02:08.839
kind of annoying to see all the different colors in
-01:58.090 --> 02:13.642
+00:02:08.840 --> 00:02:11.999
languages like TypeScript, where, you know, VS Code way
-01:58.090 --> 02:13.642
+00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:15.799
would be very full of colors. which I felt that, okay, like,
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+00:02:15.800 --> 00:02:18.759
why do I have to have that many different colors on let and
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+00:02:18.760 --> 00:02:23.759
constant or the keywords where it could be just a white text?
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It didn't have to be that colorful. So that was the bit, the
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most annoying bit when it came to context switching. And I
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felt that that just didn't happen in the Org Mode or writing
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in general. So I had to find a way to make it work, make more
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coding make my coding more kind of friendly to me and that's
-02:42.173 --> 02:59.576
+00:02:46.200 --> 00:02:50.039
when I thought maybe just the colors are something that's
-02:42.173 --> 02:59.576
+00:02:50.040 --> 00:02:54.039
bothering me and it actually was the case and that's how I got
-02:42.173 --> 02:59.576
+00:02:54.040 --> 00:02:59.359
to more into the color kind of journey and got too much into it
-02:42.173 --> 02:59.576
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I guess. Right, and was it what eventually motivated you to
NOTE What motivated you to learn Elisp and get into the Emacs core?
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learn Elisp and to get into the Emacs core? Because it's
-03:05.798 --> 03:22.406
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funny how you find plenty of people using Emacs in Org Mode
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+00:03:09.400 --> 00:03:11.399
and then they find something that they take particular
-03:05.798 --> 03:22.406
+00:03:11.400 --> 00:03:15.039
issue with, for you it's the color, and then they just go all
-03:05.798 --> 03:22.406
+00:03:15.040 --> 00:03:18.039
in trying to pull the rope as far as they can to try to
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+00:03:18.040 --> 00:03:21.359
understand as much as possible about what code is managing
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+00:03:21.360 --> 00:03:23.879
this part of the application. Like for you it was color, for
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+00:03:23.880 --> 00:03:27.999
me it was the org agenda, I desperately wanted to make Org
-03:25.367 --> 03:30.692
+00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:32.439
Agenda do something that it wasn't able to do. And five
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years, well, actually, no, 10 years later, I find myself
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+00:03:35.200 --> 00:03:38.199
hosting Emacs Cons. So, you never know just how far you're
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going to be pulling this rope. So, it's really interesting
-03:39.561 --> 03:42.224
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for me that my call was this. But back to the question, is this
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what eventually motivated you to get into Elisp and the core
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+00:03:47.760 --> 00:03:53.439
of Emacs? I think that the original journey to move to Emacs
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+00:03:53.440 --> 00:03:56.959
was around keybindings that I got annoyed with with other
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+00:03:56.960 --> 00:03:59.839
solutions, not just, you know, not speaking of Emacs
-03:49.798 --> 04:02.250
+00:03:59.840 --> 00:04:02.879
keybinding or anything, like anything in general. The main
-04:02.870 --> 04:09.797
+00:04:02.880 --> 00:04:07.519
reason was that I used Dovrak keyboard layout, and that
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meant that all the C-c, C-v, C-p, whatever, It just is
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+00:04:10.800 --> 00:04:13.919
all over the place. So I had to find something that could work
-04:11.577 --> 04:14.298
+00:04:13.920 --> 00:04:17.039
for me. And Emacs was a solution that allowed me to do
-04:14.898 --> 04:17.499
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anything. And that's the kind of the journey that it
-04:18.019 --> 04:21.519
+00:04:20.480 --> 00:04:24.039
originally started. And from there, started tweaking org
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mode and writing experience to be tuned to my liking. Color
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was another thing that I thought, OK, maybe I could do it
-04:29.101 --> 04:33.682
+00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:36.239
easily with org mode. And when I started to use more of the
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coding side of things on Emacs, I felt that, okay, that was
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something I needed to solve. So Elisp was always kind of
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just a toolkit that, you know, I knew that it was available. I
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knew that it would be something that I want to be able to use.
-04:52.646 --> 04:58.090
+00:04:52.200 --> 00:04:57.159
So I think in a way color was a good segue to understand how I
-04:52.646 --> 04:58.090
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can kind of work out more of a complex logic with the editor
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+00:05:03.360 --> 00:05:06.359
without having to write JavaScript or things that I don't
-04:59.136 --> 05:07.220
+00:05:06.360 --> 00:05:09.399
particularly like. So yeah, I think the journey around the
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functional languages, functional kind of programming was
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always something that I was keen about. And yeah, the whole
-05:13.943 --> 05:16.644
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journey kind of made sense for me. And then moving on to the
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color was just one way to get more involved in. So I can
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totally see that this journey kind of making to a little bit
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different angle But yeah, we shall see how that really turns
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out. But for now, I think I'm happy with the color setup. Now I
-05:33.514 --> 05:35.095
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can really focus on the coding. Well, that's all good. And
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I'm sure plenty of people listening to you now, you know,
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find this relatable, how they eventually got into
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programming. Like for you, you did say that you were a
-05:44.222 --> 05:47.745
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software engineer now. But I found plenty of people,
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especially doing workshops, that just started you know,
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their software engineering journey just with Emacs and
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they just realized they were doing something completely
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different, like I was studying humanities. But then you
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touch Emacs and you realize, yeah, this whole programming
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shtick is actually pretty damn cool.
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+00:06:06.680 --> 00:06:09.079
And then you find yourself again,
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five to 10 years later, becoming a software
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engineer. So yeah, that's all good.
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+00:06:13.000 --> 00:06:13.919
So we do have a couple of
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questions and I'd like to move into them so that I, I mean,
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people have questions and for me it's okay for me to chat with
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you but obviously it's better if people ask you the question
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themselves. And again, if you want to ask questions to Ryota
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directly, feel free to join us on BBB and whenever we're done
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with the questions on the pad, I'm more than happy
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to let you ask your questions live.
NOTE Q: Is there any intention to create a library for working with more experimental color spaces? Pulling code out of Hasliberg for this purpose, perhaps?
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All right, so starting with the first question,
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is there any intention to create a library
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+00:06:40.000 --> 00:06:42.559
for working with more experimental color spaces, pulling
-06:35.982 --> 06:45.108
+00:06:42.560 --> 00:06:45.679
code out of Hasliberg for this purpose, perhaps? Although I
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+00:06:45.680 --> 00:06:50.479
do not know. Hasliberg, you might? Yeah, Hasliberg. And to
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answer the question, started the journey just for myself
-06:52.859 --> 07:04.331
+00:06:55.120 --> 00:06:58.479
and I didn't think that it would be actually useful for other
-06:52.859 --> 07:04.331
+00:06:58.480 --> 00:07:03.319
use cases and this conference talk just came about kind of
-06:52.859 --> 07:04.331
+00:07:03.320 --> 00:07:08.079
out of sheer luck really. So the idea I think I can definitely
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+00:07:08.080 --> 00:07:12.199
work it out and I don't think there will be too, the original
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+00:07:12.200 --> 00:07:17.639
code that I started with was I had to use some color space and I
-07:15.931 --> 07:21.595
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started with sRGB and then went to HSL and then went to LCH. So
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I think there has been quite a bit that I learned from it. At
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the same time, I may be tempted to actually maybe perhaps
-07:25.458 --> 07:33.885
+00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:34.159
contribute back to ct.el rather than creating my own. I
-07:34.105 --> 07:36.227
+00:07:34.160 --> 00:07:36.279
think that would make more sense perhaps.
-07:36.607 --> 00:07:39.548
+00:07:36.280 --> 00:07:39.479
But for my own kind of taste that I thought
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that it would be something I can work out in my theme,
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+00:07:42.840 --> 00:07:46.879
but I don't have any I think, you know, making a
-07:45.813 --> 07:53.975
+00:07:46.880 --> 00:07:49.999
library is definitely something that I can think about, but
-07:45.813 --> 07:53.975
+00:07:50.000 --> 00:07:53.679
perhaps maybe making it too many packages isn't exactly
-07:45.813 --> 07:53.975
+00:07:53.680 --> 00:07:57.319
what I want. But for my own use case, I think I just wanted to
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+00:07:57.320 --> 00:07:59.919
have something that just didn't have any external
-07:55.175 --> 08:06.317
+00:07:59.920 --> 00:08:04.119
dependency so that I can use the vanilla Emacs with my
-07:55.175 --> 08:06.317
+00:08:04.120 --> 00:08:09.639
colors. I think that's how it started, but I'm definitely up
-08:06.757 --> 08:11.558
+00:08:09.640 --> 00:08:13.719
for it if there is interest about it. Yeah, well, thank you
-08:12.622 --> 00:08:13.615
+00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:15.279
for this. It's always good to contribute.
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+00:08:15.280 --> 00:08:16.399
I'm tempted to say
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+00:08:16.400 --> 00:08:18.279
that's how they get you. You know, you do something really
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+00:08:18.280 --> 00:08:23.639
cool and you share it with people and they have the, you know,
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+00:08:23.640 --> 00:08:27.239
they just ask you, oh, do you have your code online? And you
-08:27.166 --> 08:28.667
+00:08:27.240 --> 00:08:29.399
realize, no, I haven't pushed it. And then they start
-08:28.707 --> 08:30.107
+00:08:29.400 --> 00:08:32.359
pressing you on. well, you need to do this, this is amazing
-08:30.287 --> 08:33.349
+00:08:32.360 --> 00:08:35.879
and you need to share it. You know, I had plenty of people ask
-08:33.849 --> 08:41.735
+00:08:35.880 --> 00:08:40.519
me to share my dot files when I was tackling the org agenda
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+00:08:40.520 --> 00:08:44.039
issue that I mentioned earlier. And yeah, eventually when
-08:42.575 --> 08:54.243
+00:08:44.040 --> 00:08:47.479
you get to publishing your stuff, you also feel great
-08:42.575 --> 08:54.243
+00:08:47.480 --> 00:08:50.279
because you're putting a little bit of your intelligence
-08:42.575 --> 08:54.243
+00:08:50.280 --> 00:08:53.679
into the world and it can be the start of the journey for
-08:42.575 --> 08:54.243
+00:08:53.680 --> 00:08:56.239
someone else. You know, maybe someone will find your
-08:54.283 --> 08:59.867
+00:08:56.240 --> 00:08:58.679
library at some point and realize, yeah, I wanted to do
-08:54.283 --> 08:59.867
+00:08:58.680 --> 00:09:01.239
something slightly differently. and then they either
-09:00.387 --> 09:10.793
+00:09:01.240 --> 00:09:04.439
contribute to a library or they make their own but it's a
-09:00.387 --> 09:10.793
+00:09:04.440 --> 00:09:07.359
complete journey that starts with just people taking the
-09:00.387 --> 09:10.793
+00:09:07.360 --> 00:09:12.039
time to publish the content of the brain basically. Yeah,
-09:11.894 --> 09:13.354
+00:09:12.040 --> 00:09:15.519
that's the power of open source now. It's just how we really
-09:13.654 --> 09:21.276
+00:09:15.520 --> 00:09:19.119
appreciate the open source culture being cultivated
-09:13.654 --> 09:21.276
+00:09:19.120 --> 00:09:23.159
throughout so many years. And yeah, this is something that
-09:21.736 --> 09:24.337
+00:09:23.160 --> 00:09:26.999
I'm definitely keen about. So yeah, open for suggestions.
-09:26.618 --> 09:29.298
+00:09:27.000 --> 00:09:30.079
And exactly, that's how I started with the journey. And
-00:09:29.760 --> 00:09:33.559
+00:09:30.080 --> 00:09:33.519
yeah, while this is very experimental and very personal,
-00:09:33.560 --> 00:09:38.239
+00:09:33.520 --> 00:09:38.199
yeah, I'm not, you know, tied down to one particular way
-00:09:38.240 --> 00:09:41.679
+00:09:38.200 --> 00:09:41.399
only. So yeah we'll be open to suggestions like this one
-00:09:41.680 --> 00:09:44.839
+00:09:41.400 --> 00:09:44.719
which I would definitely think about. Yeah that's amazing
-00:09:44.840 --> 00:09:46.879
+00:09:44.720 --> 00:09:46.999
and just to be clear you know this is not a there's no
-00:09:46.880 --> 00:09:47.840
+00:09:47.000 --> 00:09:50.639
incentive one. I'm not pushing you to publish your library.
-09:51.070 --> 09:57.595
+00:09:50.640 --> 00:09:53.799
You know it was very personal for you and at the end if you
-09:51.070 --> 09:57.595
+00:09:53.800 --> 00:09:56.199
believe it might be useful for others it's a nice thing to
-09:51.070 --> 09:57.595
+00:09:56.200 --> 00:09:58.799
eventually think about publishing it. But just the fact
-09:58.056 --> 10:00.117
+00:09:58.800 --> 00:10:01.439
that you showed up at EmacsConf... Sorry, I'm
-10:01.278 --> 00:10:02.698
+00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:02.639
starting to lose my voice on the morning
-00:10:02.699 --> 00:10:03.280
+00:10:02.640 --> 00:10:03.839
of the first day. That's
-10:03.520 --> 00:10:08.559
+00:10:03.840 --> 00:10:07.639
not boding well for the two next days. I mean, just one day.
-00:10:08.560 --> 00:10:10.079
+00:10:07.640 --> 00:10:09.159
But just the
-00:10:10.080 --> 00:10:13.279
+00:10:09.160 --> 00:10:13.199
fact that you're showing up at EmacsConf and sharing about
-00:10:13.280 --> 00:10:17.119
+00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:17.039
all of this, the process, how you got to it eventually, it's
-00:10:17.120 --> 00:10:19.439
+00:10:17.040 --> 00:10:19.639
also a part of sharing. And I think it's also amazing in its
-00:10:19.440 --> 00:10:26.039
+00:10:19.640 --> 00:10:26.039
own way. Absolutely. Okay, I'm going to try to read the next
-00:10:26.040 --> 00:10:31.719
+00:10:26.040 --> 00:10:31.639
question and then try to cough a little bit. So can we have...
-00:10:31.720 --> 00:10:36.919
+00:10:31.640 --> 00:10:36.759
Oh, sorry, Bala. Sorry. I was the one who asked the question.
-00:10:36.920 --> 00:10:40.120
+00:10:36.760 --> 00:10:40.279
I thought I could ask it live here rather than... Thank you.
-10:40.188 --> 10:41.368
+00:10:40.280 --> 00:10:46.039
I'll go cough a little bit. So here I am. Thanks, Ryota, for
-10:45.050 --> 10:47.190
+00:10:46.040 --> 00:10:50.519
the nice talk. This is great. I loved it. Your attention to
-10:49.531 --> 00:10:50.140
+00:10:50.520 --> 00:10:51.519
detail was awesome.
NOTE Q: Can we have a dark as well as light theme variations made from your theme?
-00:10:51.880 --> 00:10:55.079
+00:10:51.520 --> 00:10:54.959
So I was just looking at the code and I was
-00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:58.839
+00:10:54.960 --> 00:10:58.759
wondering, do you have a dark and a light theme variation
-00:10:58.840 --> 00:11:02.479
+00:10:58.760 --> 00:11:02.599
which can be made from your theme? Or do you have to customize
-00:11:02.480 --> 00:11:05.519
+00:11:02.600 --> 00:11:06.199
it every time? That was my question. And thanks for that.
-00:11:05.520 --> 00:11:07.640
+00:11:06.200 --> 00:11:09.679
Thank you very much. I appreciate your feedback and
-00:11:10.240 --> 00:11:15.079
+00:11:09.680 --> 00:11:15.039
questions. So to answer the question, the short answer is
-00:11:15.080 --> 00:11:18.639
+00:11:15.040 --> 00:11:18.439
that I do have both dark and light themes with some sorts of
-00:11:18.640 --> 00:11:22.199
+00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:22.199
standard colors that I personally liked. And there were a
-00:11:22.200 --> 00:11:26.719
+00:11:22.200 --> 00:11:26.679
few things that I showed in the demo. where I showed, I think,
-00:11:26.720 --> 00:11:30.039
+00:11:26.680 --> 00:11:29.999
three different dark theme colors. So light theme is
-00:11:30.040 --> 00:11:31.440
+00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:31.559
definitely something that I can do.
-00:11:31.800 --> 00:11:33.879
+00:11:31.560 --> 00:11:33.759
And the idea around Hasliberg theme
-00:11:33.880 --> 00:11:36.359
+00:11:33.760 --> 00:11:36.279
and just my theming in general was that
-00:11:36.360 --> 00:11:39.679
+00:11:36.280 --> 00:11:39.599
when I feel like I want to work in dark theme and when I want to
-00:11:39.680 --> 00:11:42.440
+00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:42.159
work in the standard way, I would just use the standard color.
-00:11:42.480 --> 00:11:44.959
+00:11:42.160 --> 00:11:44.919
But when I feel like maybe it's just so cold that I want
-00:11:44.960 --> 00:11:49.399
+00:11:44.920 --> 00:11:48.519
to have a bit of a warm colors near me, I would use the orange
-00:11:49.400 --> 00:11:52.359
+00:11:48.520 --> 00:11:52.279
theme, without changing too much of the kind of general
-00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:55.679
+00:11:52.280 --> 00:11:55.639
feeling and experience. So that can be said for the light
-00:11:55.680 --> 00:11:58.959
+00:11:55.640 --> 00:11:58.959
theme as well. So there is something and the kind of
-00:11:58.960 --> 00:12:04.919
+00:11:58.960 --> 00:12:04.839
customization isn't that difficult to extend. So I do have
-00:12:04.920 --> 00:12:09.079
+00:12:04.840 --> 00:12:09.359
both dark and light, but primarily I'm just looking at the
-00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:10.239
+00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:12.839
dark theme as my main driver. But yeah, they are both
-00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:13.240
+00:12:12.840 --> 00:12:18.239
available. Great. Thank you so much. I will definitely try
-00:12:18.208 --> 12:18.865
+00:12:18.240 --> 00:12:21.719
your theme out. I'm definitely on the lookout for a nice,
-12:19.205 --> 12:22.426
+00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:26.119
friendly theme. Thank you very much. As I said, this is a
-12:25.388 --> 12:27.429
+00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:31.279
personal theme. I'm not sure if it really fits everyone's
-12:29.089 --> 12:42.816
+00:12:31.280 --> 00:12:37.159
need, but it is one inspiration that I hope that can lead to
-12:29.089 --> 12:42.816
+00:12:37.160 --> 00:12:40.639
another nice theming that could work for someone
-12:29.089 --> 12:42.816
+00:12:40.640 --> 00:12:44.199
specifically for some use cases. I don't have to solve
-12:42.996 --> 12:44.977
+00:12:44.200 --> 00:12:48.719
everyone's problem. Yeah, and I mean, it was sufficient to
-12:46.553 --> 12:49.715
+00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:50.719
be inspirational to people. I mean, just Bala just
-12:49.755 --> 12:58.619
+00:12:50.720 --> 00:12:53.759
mentioned it right now, but I'm sure plenty of people who
-12:49.755 --> 12:58.619
+00:12:53.760 --> 00:12:55.999
watched live, but also people will be watching in the
-12:49.755 --> 12:58.619
+00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:58.599
future, will have the interest to speak by what you've done.
-12:58.699 --> 13:00.040
+00:12:58.600 --> 00:13:05.079
So thank you again so much for this. Yep. All right, well, I
-13:04.102 --> 13:06.603
+00:13:05.080 --> 00:13:09.719
don't see any further questions. So I suggest we move
-13:07.083 --> 13:10.525
+00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:14.279
towards closure. Ryota, do you have any last words? No, I
-13:13.775 --> 13:14.175
+00:13:14.280 --> 00:13:17.079
don't. So yeah, thank you very much for attending. And it was
-13:16.577 --> 13:18.979
+00:13:17.080 --> 00:13:20.519
great fun putting this together. And I really didn't think
-13:19.299 --> 13:27.545
+00:13:20.520 --> 00:13:24.759
that I would be talking about my personal colors and
-13:19.299 --> 13:27.545
+00:13:24.760 --> 00:13:27.759
personal favorites, like orange being my favorite color.
-13:27.845 --> 13:31.228
+00:13:27.760 --> 00:13:30.119
This wouldn't be something that I would say out in any
-13:27.845 --> 13:31.228
+00:13:30.120 --> 00:13:34.159
conference, to be honest. But it just came out to be. And
-13:33.890 --> 13:35.491
+00:13:34.160 --> 00:13:37.479
happy that I had a chance. So thank you very much for giving me
-13:35.651 --> 13:39.154
+00:13:37.480 --> 00:13:41.439
the opportunity to talk. in this amazing conference and
-13:39.574 --> 13:52.473
+00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:44.319
yeah I can't just wait to check out other talks which you know
-13:39.574 --> 13:52.473
+00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:46.919
I know that there isn't you know other talks that are
-13:39.574 --> 13:52.473
+00:13:46.920 --> 00:13:50.199
happening right now I was actually wanted to to join them and
-13:39.574 --> 13:52.473
+00:13:50.200 --> 00:13:52.759
check check that out so I will probably do that right now.
-13:53.419 --> 13:53.899
+00:13:52.760 --> 00:13:56.839
Well, sure. Well, I won't hold you any longer then. Thank
-13:56.401 --> 13:56.741
+00:13:56.840 --> 00:13:59.759
you. For me, it was just amazing to, you know, generally when
-13:57.682 --> 14:03.285
+00:13:59.760 --> 00:14:01.639
you ask someone what their favorite color, you know, they
-13:57.682 --> 14:03.285
+00:14:01.640 --> 00:14:04.399
just tell you orange or blue or whatever. They don't go then
-14:03.586 --> 14:10.690
+00:14:04.400 --> 00:14:07.039
to chat about 20 minutes about their favorite color and how
-14:03.586 --> 14:10.690
+00:14:07.040 --> 00:14:10.079
they tuned their entire editor to work exactly around their
-14:03.586 --> 14:10.690
+00:14:10.080 --> 00:14:14.759
favorite colors. So it was inspiring. And I also want to try
-14:12.912 --> 14:21.057
+00:14:14.760 --> 00:14:17.999
it out, frankly, because my theme has been utterly bad for
-14:12.912 --> 14:21.057
+00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:20.639
the last five years and I need some change into my life. All
-14:21.497 --> 14:21.677
+00:14:20.640 --> 00:14:24.319
right. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you very much,
-14:23.629 --> 14:24.654
+00:14:24.320 --> 00:14:30.640
everyone. Cheers. Bye-bye.
+
diff --git a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-gypsum--gypsum-my-clone-of-emacs-and-elisp-written-in-scheme--ramin-honary--answers.vtt b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-gypsum--gypsum-my-clone-of-emacs-and-elisp-written-in-scheme--ramin-honary--answers.vtt
index 0142a879..7c2708d9 100644
--- a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-gypsum--gypsum-my-clone-of-emacs-and-elisp-written-in-scheme--ramin-honary--answers.vtt
+++ b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-gypsum--gypsum-my-clone-of-emacs-and-elisp-written-in-scheme--ramin-honary--answers.vtt
@@ -1,725 +1,725 @@
WEBVTT
-00:00.069 --> 00:01.850
-Troy Hinckley's project that I'm talking about. I was going
+00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.999
+...Troy Hinckley's project that I'm talking about. I was going
-00:02.350 --> 00:22.139
+00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:08.799
to mention this in my presentation, but it's possible,
-00:02.350 --> 00:22.139
+00:00:08.800 --> 00:00:16.359
theoretically, that Troy Hinckley, his project could be
-00:02.350 --> 00:22.139
+00:00:16.360 --> 00:00:18.559
used as a scheme of limitation that actually runs my own
-00:02.350 --> 00:22.139
+00:00:18.560 --> 00:00:23.759
version of Emacs. And although, you know, This is
-00:25.478 --> 00:29.380
+00:00:23.760 --> 00:00:30.719
completely theoretical, and I don't know how difficult
-00:25.478 --> 00:29.380
+00:00:30.720 --> 00:00:34.079
that would be. But if Troy Hinckley implemented enough of
-00:30.781 --> 00:47.029
+00:00:34.080 --> 00:00:39.879
the R7-RS standard in Rust, it would theoretically be
-00:30.781 --> 00:47.029
+00:00:39.880 --> 00:00:46.719
possible to run the Gypsum editor in Troy Hinckley's own
-00:30.781 --> 00:47.029
+00:00:46.720 --> 00:00:50.239
editor. I thought that was kind of interesting, and I
-00:48.270 --> 00:53.833
+00:00:50.240 --> 00:00:59.119
thought it was worth mentioning, at least in the questions
-00:48.270 --> 00:53.833
+00:00:59.120 --> 00:01:12.159
and answers.
-01:12.179 --> 01:14.080
+00:01:12.160 --> 00:01:16.199
I also mentioned this in the presentation. I wanted to see
-01:14.940 --> 01:22.364
+00:01:16.200 --> 00:01:20.119
Robin Templeton's project presentation, but
-01:14.940 --> 01:22.364
+00:01:20.120 --> 00:01:22.399
unfortunately it's going to be at like four in the morning
-01:14.940 --> 01:22.364
+00:01:22.400 --> 00:01:26.239
for me. So I'm going to try and watch that tomorrow, but
-01:22.984 --> 01:31.428
+00:01:26.240 --> 00:01:29.559
that's also going to be a very interesting project to keep an
-01:22.984 --> 01:31.428
+00:01:29.560 --> 00:01:34.039
eye on if you're interested in Scheme. That's the project
-01:33.149 --> 01:38.051
+00:01:34.040 --> 00:01:37.519
where you've got the Guylain interpreter running inside of
-01:33.149 --> 01:38.051
+00:01:37.520 --> 00:02:04.679
the Emacs process. It's dynamically linked as a library.
-02:04.699 --> 02:06.748
+00:02:04.680 --> 00:02:08.759
I'm ready for questions from anybody. You can ask or you can
-02:07.431 --> 02:09.079
+00:02:08.760 --> 00:02:32.079
type. It's up to you.
-02:32.319 --> 02:34.521
+00:02:32.080 --> 00:02:37.319
Okay, let me check the etherpad.
-02:37.304 --> 02:38.245
+00:02:37.320 --> 00:02:41.159
Let's see here.
-02:41.208 --> 02:42.830
+00:02:41.160 --> 00:02:42.719
I'm not sure if I'm doing that right.
-02:46.373 --> 02:47.554
+00:02:42.720 --> 00:02:54.199
Let me check one more time. Oh, there it goes.
-02:54.221 --> 02:55.702
+00:02:54.200 --> 00:03:00.079
Let's see, so this is...
-03:00.151 --> 03:02.072
+00:03:00.080 --> 00:03:02.239
I didn't know about that first bit of history. Oh, I've heard
-03:02.332 --> 00:03:09.369
+00:03:02.240 --> 00:03:06.119
RMS say that Scheme Guile is just a nicer Lisp, but I didn't
-03:02.332 --> 03:09.776
+00:03:06.120 --> 00:03:09.079
know there were concrete talks attempts to use Guile for
-03:02.332 --> 03:09.776
+00:03:09.080 --> 00:03:14.319
Emacs that early. Let's see, that was from janneke.
NOTE Q: I'm curious to know how the hell guile-emacs deals with all of the dynamically scoped modules out there. Is there any effort to automatically modularize and namespace stuff?
-00:03:09.370 --> 00:03:19.241
+00:03:14.320 --> 00:03:17.439
I'm curious to know how the hell Guile Emacs deals with all the
-03:14.318 --> 03:19.241
+00:03:17.440 --> 00:03:21.359
dynamically scoped modules out there. Is there any effort
-03:20.181 --> 03:24.943
+00:03:21.360 --> 00:03:29.759
to automatically modularize and name? Let's see.
-03:30.523 --> 03:35.806
+00:03:29.760 --> 00:03:40.919
That might be a better question for Robin Templeton. In my
-03:36.727 --> 03:46.573
+00:03:40.920 --> 00:03:44.639
own project,
-03:36.727 --> 03:46.573
+00:03:44.640 --> 00:03:49.399
there's no module system for Emacs Lisp. There is a module
-03:46.693 --> 03:48.234
+00:03:49.400 --> 00:03:55.559
system for Scheme. And the Emacs Lisp interpreter runs in
-03:49.695 --> 03:55.158
+00:03:55.560 --> 00:04:01.599
its own environment. the require system or whatever module
-03:57.068 --> 04:11.736
+00:04:01.600 --> 00:04:06.359
system that Emacs has, once it's implemented, all of that
-03:57.068 --> 04:11.736
+00:04:06.360 --> 00:04:09.759
would just happen inside of the Emacs Lisp environment,
-03:57.068 --> 04:11.736
+00:04:09.760 --> 00:04:12.399
which is inside of the Scheme environment. And
-04:12.437 --> 04:15.898
+00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:21.479
environments are objects in Scheme.
-04:21.522 --> 04:24.103
+00:04:21.480 --> 00:04:26.399
I think a more difficult question is how to handle
-04:26.420 --> 04:31.942
+00:04:26.400 --> 00:04:33.279
threading, and Scheme has very good threading built in, in
-04:26.420 --> 04:31.942
+00:04:33.280 --> 00:04:34.839
Serphe-18[??].
-04:34.283 --> 04:48.028
+00:04:34.840 --> 00:04:43.399
But I don't think it will be easy to write Emacs Lisp form
-04:34.283 --> 04:48.028
+00:04:43.400 --> 00:04:48.479
bindings to the Scheme multi-threading implementation.
-04:48.548 --> 04:50.749
+00:04:48.480 --> 00:04:52.279
Emacs Lisp was just not cut out for that kind of thing. So I
-04:51.710 --> 04:59.894
+00:04:52.280 --> 00:04:56.559
think each Emacs Lisp, you could, I suppose, have multiple
-04:51.710 --> 04:59.894
+00:04:56.560 --> 00:05:00.039
threads each running their own Emacs Lisp environment.
-05:01.375 --> 05:02.956
+00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:04.999
Scheme would make that very simple to do.
-05:06.018 --> 05:16.744
+00:05:05.000 --> 00:05:08.759
And then there'd just be a question of how you would get those
-05:06.018 --> 05:16.744
+00:05:08.760 --> 00:05:11.679
different interpreters to communicate with each other,
-05:06.018 --> 05:16.744
+00:05:11.680 --> 00:05:16.279
perhaps using the same protocol that's used by the Emacs
-05:06.018 --> 05:16.744
+00:05:16.280 --> 00:05:23.639
server. But I haven't thought that far ahead yet.
NOTE Q: Would it be possible to support a GUI toolkit other than GTK?
-05:23.646 --> 05:28.709
+00:05:23.640 --> 00:05:26.839
Would it be possible to support a GUI toolkit other than the
-05:23.646 --> 05:28.709
+00:05:26.840 --> 00:05:31.319
GTK? Like, how is it still supports Lucid? Yes, this is
-05:31.291 --> 05:33.232
+00:05:31.320 --> 00:05:36.999
absolutely a goal of the project. I'm trying to keep the back
-05:33.873 --> 05:38.416
+00:05:37.000 --> 00:05:41.599
end separate as possible. The scheme has what you call
-05:39.817 --> 05:42.478
+00:05:41.600 --> 00:05:45.239
parameters. And these are like global variables that are
-05:43.199 --> 05:46.221
+00:05:45.240 --> 00:05:50.519
still somewhat thread safe. And every call to the GUI goes
-05:47.484 --> 05:51.225
+00:05:50.520 --> 00:05:58.199
through a parameter. So the Emacs, the interpreter and the
-05:52.125 --> 05:59.367
+00:05:58.200 --> 00:06:01.679
editor logic is all in one module. And then that module calls
-05:59.987 --> 06:04.309
+00:06:01.680 --> 00:06:06.319
out into a separate GUI module. And then you can implement
-06:04.989 --> 06:07.690
+00:06:06.320 --> 00:06:11.599
different GUI modules. So you could have one for GTK3, one
-06:08.430 --> 06:13.171
+00:06:11.600 --> 00:06:16.879
for GTK4, if you want to write the extern C bindings around Qt
-06:13.843 --> 06:20.725
+00:06:16.880 --> 00:06:21.199
or full tick, that would certainly be possible as well. It
-06:21.185 --> 06:32.168
+00:06:21.200 --> 00:06:25.919
would be nice maybe to have an SDL implementation based
-06:21.185 --> 06:32.168
+00:06:25.920 --> 00:06:30.999
maybe on Chikiti or some kind of immediate mode GUI,
-06:21.185 --> 06:32.168
+00:06:31.000 --> 00:06:37.399
something like that. But definitely GTK3 through Guile GI
-06:33.808 --> 06:38.750
+00:06:37.400 --> 00:06:41.319
is the reference implementation. Things start there. But
-06:41.298 --> 06:43.959
+00:06:41.320 --> 00:06:43.999
I'm very interested in supporting other GUIs, yes. Let's
-06:45.199 --> 00:06:45.256
+00:06:44.000 --> 00:06:46.039
see.
NOTE Q: Do you plan to provide improvements to Elisp as a language, or is the focus on a compatibility layer to facilitate doing all new extensions, etc. in Scheme?
-00:06:45.257 --> 00:06:45.879
+00:06:46.040 --> 00:06:50.759
Question, do you plan to provide improvements to ELisp
-06:47.540 --> 06:56.342
+00:06:50.760 --> 00:06:54.519
as a language or focus on a compatibility layer to
-06:47.540 --> 06:56.342
+00:06:54.520 --> 00:06:57.999
facilitate all new extensions in Scheme? Yeah, the second
-06:57.142 --> 06:57.962
+00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:04.719
one. I want to move off to Scheme. I would like for this
-07:03.384 --> 07:05.264
+00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:08.999
project to try and keep up to date with each new release of
-07:05.666 --> 07:10.789
+00:07:09.000 --> 00:07:13.799
Emacs and Emacs Lisp. That's a difficult moving target to
-07:11.850 --> 07:14.552
+00:07:13.800 --> 00:07:18.639
follow, I realize. But to the greatest extent possible, any
-07:15.152 --> 07:23.397
+00:07:18.640 --> 00:07:25.239
new features to Emacs Lisp will be pulled in from GNU Emacs.
-07:25.419 --> 07:29.041
+00:07:25.240 --> 00:07:28.599
If we happen to be able to implement something cool in
-07:25.419 --> 07:29.041
+00:07:28.600 --> 00:07:31.639
Scheme, and be able to port it over to Emacs Lisp, then sure,
-07:29.437 --> 07:36.543
+00:07:31.640 --> 00:07:35.799
it'd be nice to be able to upload or to submit that upstream to
-07:29.437 --> 07:36.543
+00:07:35.800 --> 00:07:43.079
the GNU Emacs. But I think I would prefer to have new features
-07:38.584 --> 07:43.708
+00:07:43.080 --> 00:07:47.799
written in Scheme. I would like this gypsum to be more of a
-07:43.989 --> 07:52.075
+00:07:47.800 --> 00:07:51.479
Scheme app platform that just happens to be able to also run
-07:43.989 --> 07:52.075
+00:07:51.480 --> 00:07:56.199
Emacs Lisp. That's how I see it. Of course, this will be a
-07:54.577 --> 07:56.699
+00:07:56.200 --> 00:08:00.799
community project. I'm open to debate about that if anybody
-07:58.809 --> 08:02.012
+00:08:00.800 --> 00:08:02.079
wants to convince me otherwise.
-08:08.439 --> 08:11.683
+00:08:02.080 --> 00:08:11.759
Why is being able to interpret all of that EL a useful goal?
-08:12.464 --> 08:14.626
+00:08:11.760 --> 00:08:15.519
Sure, there is a lot of code written in Elisp. Can we
-08:15.206 --> 08:17.749
+00:08:15.520 --> 00:08:18.959
consider... Oh, it's still being written. Please go ahead
-08:18.390 --> 08:19.491
+00:08:18.960 --> 00:08:19.439
and finish writing.
NOTE Q: Can we consider a translator like utility to convert elisp to scheme, once guile-emacs becomes a reality?
-08:29.673 --> 08:35.576
+00:08:19.440 --> 00:08:32.519
Can we consider a translator like utility to convert eLisp
-08:29.673 --> 08:35.576
+00:08:32.520 --> 00:08:37.519
to Scheme once Guile-Emacs has become a reality?
-08:36.716 --> 08:37.076
+00:08:37.520 --> 00:08:42.119
Certainly. For the time being, I just wanted to get the
-08:38.717 --> 08:42.639
+00:08:42.120 --> 00:08:47.559
interpreter running. So the actual, the Guile-Emacs Lisp,
-08:44.520 --> 08:58.666
+00:08:47.560 --> 00:08:51.919
the one that was written in 2011 that I didn't write, that
-08:44.520 --> 08:58.666
+00:08:51.920 --> 00:08:57.599
actually does compile to, I think it's the tree
-08:44.520 --> 08:58.666
+00:08:57.600 --> 00:08:59.239
intermediate representation It's one of the intermediate
-08:59.076 --> 09:03.697
+00:08:59.240 --> 00:09:03.759
languages that Guile uses to compile Guile scheme itself.
-09:04.817 --> 09:09.299
+00:09:03.760 --> 00:09:09.079
So the Emacs lisp that was written before actually does
-09:04.817 --> 09:09.299
+00:09:09.080 --> 00:09:13.119
that. It actually compiles and makes use of the entire Guile
-09:09.339 --> 09:20.761
+00:09:13.120 --> 00:09:17.479
compiler tool chain and actually produces like JIT
-09:09.339 --> 09:20.761
+00:09:17.480 --> 00:09:21.719
compilable binaries, which is really cool. Like I said,
-09:23.342 --> 09:25.943
+00:09:21.720 --> 00:09:27.519
that's the one that I had trouble getting to work properly.
-09:29.209 --> 09:30.890
+00:09:27.520 --> 00:09:34.399
Maybe we can follow that architecture. I'm not sure how to do
-09:33.052 --> 09:45.102
+00:09:34.400 --> 00:09:37.919
that, but I would like to be able to do some kind of
-09:33.052 --> 09:45.102
+00:09:37.920 --> 00:09:41.999
translating, keeping in mind that we want to have this be
-09:33.052 --> 09:45.102
+00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:48.919
portable, do various schemes. And so Guile makes this very
-09:45.988 --> 09:50.289
+00:09:48.920 --> 00:09:52.719
easy, but other schemes don't. Gambit might do this pretty
-09:51.549 --> 09:53.530
+00:09:52.720 --> 00:09:57.919
well as well. It compiles to C and then compiles C down to a
-09:53.950 --> 10:01.471
+00:09:57.920 --> 00:10:06.159
dynamically linkable library. So yeah, I think probably
-10:03.372 --> 10:09.373
+00:10:06.160 --> 00:10:09.559
the most portable, I'm just thinking out loud right now,
-10:10.652 --> 10:21.715
+00:10:09.560 --> 00:10:13.239
most portable implementation will just be able to
-10:10.652 --> 10:21.715
+00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:17.119
translate Emacs Lisp directly to Scheme, which is not what
-10:10.652 --> 10:21.715
+00:10:17.120 --> 00:10:22.439
the old Guile Emacs Lisp implementation does. That goes to
-10:21.755 --> 10:26.777
+00:10:22.440 --> 00:10:26.439
TreeIL, so it's very, very Guile-specific, can't be
-10:21.755 --> 10:26.777
+00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:30.799
ported. But yeah, if we could somehow get Emacs Lisp
-10:28.359 --> 10:42.045
+00:10:30.800 --> 00:10:36.999
translated to Scheme and then compiled, say, in Shea Scheme
-10:28.359 --> 10:42.045
+00:10:37.000 --> 00:10:40.879
or Gambit or MIT Scheme or one of those other compilers, that
-10:28.359 --> 10:42.045
+00:10:40.880 --> 00:10:44.919
would be very cool. And I would absolutely love to do that.
-10:44.906 --> 10:49.948
+00:10:44.920 --> 00:10:49.279
And I would very quickly accept any code into the code base
-10:44.906 --> 10:49.948
+00:10:49.280 --> 00:10:50.599
that would do that.
NOTE Q: Why is being able to interpret all of \`init.el\` an useful goal?
-10:54.390 --> 10:56.291
+00:10:50.600 --> 00:10:59.119
Oh, and to answer the question about init.el,
-10:59.207 --> 11:17.215
+00:10:59.120 --> 00:11:02.839
It's just because people spend a lot of time on their configs
-10:59.207 --> 11:17.215
+00:11:02.840 --> 00:11:06.959
and it would be nice if, you know, you're starting to use this
-10:59.207 --> 11:17.215
+00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:14.079
new editor and want it to be similar to Emacs users, just the
-10:59.207 --> 11:17.215
+00:11:14.080 --> 00:11:16.519
Emacs community in general and people who are familiar with
-10:59.207 --> 11:17.215
+00:11:16.520 --> 00:11:20.879
using Emacs. It would be more useful to everybody in the
-11:17.715 --> 11:25.379
+00:11:20.880 --> 00:11:25.119
Emacs community if this were more compatible with GNU
-11:17.715 --> 11:25.379
+00:11:25.120 --> 00:11:35.999
Emacs. And so that's why that's, I think that's an important
-11:25.679 --> 11:27.960
+00:11:36.000 --> 00:11:38.559
goal.
-11:34.465 --> 11:35.467
+00:11:38.560 --> 00:12:01.839
Question is not yet. Great. Oh, here comes another
-11:38.471 --> 11:39.613
+00:12:01.840 --> 00:12:02.279
question.
NOTE Q: What is the plan to handle elisp packages that depend on 3rd party/external libraries? (libgit/magit or rg/ripgrep)?
-12:08.539 --> 12:17.742
+00:12:02.280 --> 00:12:11.879
Okay, what is the plan to handle elisp packages that depend
-12:08.539 --> 12:17.742
+00:12:11.880 --> 00:12:16.119
on third-party or external libraries like git or magit
-12:08.539 --> 12:17.742
+00:12:16.120 --> 00:12:22.719
or ripgrep? So that's going to be tricky. It depends on how
-12:21.523 --> 12:26.224
+00:12:22.720 --> 00:12:27.079
these external packages are linked into emacs. If it's
-12:26.844 --> 12:33.646
+00:12:27.080 --> 00:12:32.879
going to be a dynamic library like Robin Templeton's
-12:26.844 --> 12:33.646
+00:12:32.880 --> 00:12:38.039
project which you load the libgit library into the Emacs
-12:35.289 --> 12:41.931
+00:12:38.040 --> 00:12:43.159
process, that is going to be extremely difficult. So if you
-12:44.032 --> 12:52.975
+00:12:43.160 --> 00:12:49.359
have an external library like, I don't know, libgit or
-12:44.032 --> 12:52.975
+00:12:49.360 --> 00:12:59.279
what's the GUI thing? Cabal. No, not Cabal. Cairo, libcairo
-12:57.736 --> 13:01.398
+00:12:59.280 --> 00:13:01.439
to do SVG graphics and so on.
-13:04.483 --> 13:17.480
+00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:09.719
You can do that very easily with Guile, but then on top of
-13:04.483 --> 13:17.480
+00:13:09.720 --> 00:13:14.719
that, implementing Emacs list bindings to it, I mean,
-13:04.483 --> 13:17.480
+00:13:14.720 --> 00:13:17.199
you've got two layers there, and that makes things pretty
-13:04.483 --> 13:17.480
+00:13:17.200 --> 00:13:23.119
difficult. So it's possible. And to some degree, maybe
-13:21.935 --> 13:30.842
+00:13:23.120 --> 00:13:27.799
necessary for example, Cairo, if we want to do SVG graphics
-13:21.935 --> 13:30.842
+00:13:27.800 --> 00:13:30.599
the way that Emacs Lisp does, we're going to have to have
-13:21.935 --> 13:30.842
+00:13:30.600 --> 00:13:33.959
that. So that would be necessary. We would have to have those
-13:32.643 --> 13:33.944
+00:13:33.960 --> 00:13:39.199
two layers. Yes, let's do that. But if it's like for Magit,
-13:38.047 --> 13:50.596
+00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:45.479
you can just call out to your git process, and then you're
-13:38.047 --> 13:50.596
+00:13:45.480 --> 00:13:50.719
just using the regular process APIs that Emacs Lisp has. And
-13:51.451 --> 13:58.475
+00:13:50.720 --> 00:13:57.119
that can be, already we, like Guile has some very good
-13:51.451 --> 13:58.475
+00:13:57.120 --> 00:14:08.079
implementations for process management. And so it would
-13:59.055 --> 14:05.438
+00:14:08.080 --> 00:14:12.439
just be a matter of wrapping up those in the Emacs lisp form
-13:59.055 --> 14:05.438
+00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:24.919
bindings. So yeah, dynamic libraries, I wanna try to avoid.
-14:12.222 --> 14:20.366
+00:14:24.920 --> 00:14:32.799
And I would prefer to do things more through, you know,
-14:12.222 --> 14:20.366
+00:14:32.800 --> 00:14:40.399
launching a child process in the Emacs process. and then
-14:20.956 --> 14:24.798
+00:14:40.400 --> 00:14:47.239
communicating over the standard in, standard out
-14:20.956 --> 14:24.798
+00:14:47.240 --> 00:14:47.959
channels.
-14:29.460 --> 14:40.386
+00:14:47.960 --> 00:14:52.799
That's the easier way to do things, I think, because then you
-14:29.460 --> 14:40.386
+00:14:52.800 --> 00:14:58.519
can just use the process library that Emacs already has, and
-14:29.460 --> 14:40.386
+00:14:58.520 --> 00:15:03.239
you can just reuse all of that code.
-14:43.969 --> 14:49.912
+00:15:03.240 --> 00:15:09.079
I'm not sure how ripgrep works, unfortunately, but I
-14:43.969 --> 14:49.912
+00:15:09.080 --> 00:15:15.279
believe that's also a process, a child process. So, we can
-14:50.412 --> 14:53.774
+00:15:15.280 --> 00:15:23.479
just reuse all of the Emacs Lisp code that does that already.
-14:54.014 --> 15:05.979
+00:15:23.480 --> 00:15:30.399
We just need to make sure that the process management
-14:54.014 --> 15:05.979
+00:15:30.400 --> 00:15:35.119
implementation and scheme is properly bound to Emacs Lisp,
-14:54.014 --> 15:05.979
+00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:43.359
and it works the same as GNU Emacs does. Once that's all set,
-15:06.360 --> 15:13.383
+00:15:43.360 --> 00:15:48.399
then these porcelains, like around git, should fall into
-15:06.360 --> 15:13.383
+00:15:48.400 --> 00:15:55.279
place. without too much difficulty, hopefully.
NOTE Q: Not really a question, but how about Schemacs as a name?
-15:21.112 --> 15:22.593
+00:15:55.280 --> 00:15:59.199
How about Schemax as a name? I like the name. I like that name.
-15:28.937 --> 15:32.920
+00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:03.119
I haven't really looked into like, is that already used or is
-15:28.937 --> 15:32.920
+00:16:03.120 --> 00:16:09.759
that going to be confusing? But certainly something we can
-15:33.380 --> 15:35.021
+00:16:09.760 --> 00:16:10.959
discuss.
-15:38.243 --> 15:39.264
+00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:13.039
Another thing I should mention,
-15:42.157 --> 15:48.278
+00:16:13.040 --> 00:16:18.759
I should probably set up a server or something like Discord
-15:42.157 --> 15:48.278
+00:16:18.760 --> 00:16:25.359
or something like that. Discourse, not Discord.
-15:51.619 --> 15:56.220
+00:16:25.360 --> 00:16:31.599
Discourse, the open source one, where we could actually
-15:51.619 --> 15:56.220
+00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:49.239
chat about this stuff. For the time being, ActivityPub,
-15:56.540 --> 16:05.562
+00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:52.399
mostly Mastodon, is how I communicate with people in real
-15:56.540 --> 16:05.562
+00:16:52.400 --> 00:16:57.279
time, that or email. So if you want to get a hold of me, check
-16:09.809 --> 16:15.571
+00:16:57.280 --> 00:17:02.439
the notes for this presentation and just send me an email.
-16:16.752 --> 16:18.012
+00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:09.039
Any question at all is fine. If you want to contribute code,
-16:19.633 --> 16:25.495
+00:17:09.040 --> 00:17:12.799
if you want to just learn how to contribute code, send me any
-16:19.633 --> 16:25.495
+00:17:12.800 --> 00:17:22.199
questions. It's fine. I'm happy to answer them. And we can
-16:30.256 --> 16:31.757
+00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:25.879
talk about the name as well.
NOTE Q: Why is it not feasible for the Emacs layer that interprets Emacs Lisp (the core in C) ot have a Scheme interpreter, instead of using Guile?
-16:45.931 --> 16:54.215
+00:17:25.880 --> 00:17:30.239
Okay, why is it not feasible for the Emacs layer that
-16:45.931 --> 16:54.215
+00:17:30.240 --> 00:17:34.319
interprets Emacs Lisp, the core in C, have a Scheme
-16:45.931 --> 16:54.215
+00:17:34.320 --> 00:17:39.799
interpreter instead of using Guile? Let's see, I have to,
-16:55.496 --> 16:57.257
+00:17:39.800 --> 00:17:48.799
okay. Emacs layer interprets Emacs Lisp, the core in C, have
-16:57.737 --> 17:05.942
+00:17:48.800 --> 00:17:54.079
a Scheme interpreter instead of using Guile. Okay, so that,
-17:07.362 --> 17:13.906
+00:17:54.080 --> 00:17:59.959
the question xlarsx is asking, xlars, x, So Lars is asking,
-17:14.744 --> 17:28.093
+00:17:59.960 --> 00:18:02.319
is it not feasible for there to be an
-17:14.744 --> 17:28.093
+00:18:02.320 --> 00:18:06.839
Emacs layer that interprets Emacs Lisp have a scheme
-17:14.744 --> 17:28.093
+00:18:06.840 --> 00:18:33.079
interpreter? This is Robin Templeton's project. And
-17:30.815 --> 17:32.156
+00:18:33.080 --> 00:18:39.839
they're presenting later today. So check the roster and be
-17:32.697 --> 17:41.303
+00:18:39.840 --> 00:18:45.199
sure to see that presentation because that's exactly what
-17:32.697 --> 17:41.303
+00:18:45.200 --> 00:18:52.119
Robin Templeton is doing. That's not what I'm doing though.
-17:44.419 --> 17:46.459
+00:18:52.120 --> 00:18:57.239
I'm trying to create something in Scheme. But yes, there is
-17:48.280 --> 17:54.921
+00:18:57.240 --> 00:19:02.959
an attempt to get an Scheme interpreter to run inside of
-17:48.280 --> 17:54.921
+00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:07.159
Emacs itself. And it has its own method of binding to Emacs
-17:55.181 --> 18:05.323
+00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:11.199
Lisp functions and translating data like Lisp structures
-17:55.181 --> 18:05.323
+00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:14.439
between Guile Scheme and Emacs Lisp. Robin will explain all
-18:05.943 --> 18:08.284
+00:19:14.440 --> 00:19:15.799
of that in their presentation.
-18:28.519 --> 18:33.020
+00:19:15.800 --> 00:19:18.919
OK, I think I've got through all the questions on Etherpad.
-18:33.620 --> 18:35.500
+00:19:18.920 --> 00:19:23.879
But I'm going to hang out here for a bit longer. And yeah, feel
-18:37.621 --> 18:46.182
+00:19:23.880 --> 00:19:28.239
free to do a video chat with me or send me more questions on
-18:37.621 --> 18:46.182
+00:19:28.240 --> 00:19:33.839
Etherpad or here in the big blue button. And so I'm just going
-18:47.002 --> 18:48.082
+00:19:33.840 --> 00:21:49.119
to hang out. And thanks for asking all your questions. And
-18:51.663 --> 18:56.024
+00:21:49.120 --> 00:21:50.839
yeah, I look forward to working with all of you if you're
-18:51.663 --> 18:56.024
+00:21:50.840 --> 00:21:51.799
interested. take it easy. Thanks so much for the talk and
-18:59.935 --> 19:08.180
+00:21:51.800 --> 00:21:53.199
looking forward to seeing some of your progress as this
-18:59.935 --> 19:08.180
+00:21:53.200 --> 00:21:54.359
moves forward, exciting space. We'll go ahead and leave the
-19:09.261 --> 19:14.925
+00:21:54.360 --> 00:21:54.879
room open for you and thanks for offering to hang out and chat
-19:09.261 --> 19:14.925
+00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:55.639
with other people that come by. Feel free to throw something
-19:15.025 --> 19:18.287
+00:21:55.640 --> 00:21:56.719
in the chat if you want to remind people you're still here.
-19:19.557 --> 19:25.143
+00:21:56.720 --> 00:21:57.919
Meanwhile, on the stream, we have moved along to our next
-19:19.557 --> 19:25.143
+00:21:57.920 --> 00:21:59.599
talk on Rust, and that is just getting started. But again,
-19:25.283 --> 19:30.549
+00:21:59.600 --> 00:22:00.479
we're continuing to record this, and I'll just keep an eye on
-19:25.283 --> 19:30.549
+00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:01.239
it to stop the recording. Thank you. Thank you. It was
-19:33.352 --> 19:33.853
+00:22:01.240 --> 00:22:01.559
awesome.
-21:47.935 --> 21:50.558
+00:22:01.560 --> 00:22:03.959
So it seems like it's slowed down here for the Q&A. I don't see
-21:50.638 --> 21:53.741
+00:22:03.960 --> 00:22:05.439
anybody else on BBB, so I'm going to go ahead and stop the
-21:50.638 --> 21:53.741
+00:22:05.440 --> 00:22:08.479
recording. We can start it back up. I would say, yes, there's
-21:55.282 --> 21:58.906
+00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:09.519
a lot of things you can do with this. You can handle
-21:58.926 --> 22:00.627
+00:22:09.520 --> 00:22:11.239
processing. Yeah, I'm going to try and join over the chat for
-22:02.029 --> 22:07.614
+00:22:11.240 --> 00:22:14.679
the next talk. I'm not sure if I can do both big blue buttons at
-22:08.635 --> 22:11.538
+00:22:14.680 --> 00:22:15.759
the same time. You should be able to just watch your mute
-22:13.206 --> 22:19.998
+00:22:15.760 --> 00:22:19.159
settings and mute tab settings and whatever all you have to
-22:13.206 --> 22:19.998
+00:22:19.160 --> 00:23:37.800
avoid bleed through. Okay.
diff --git a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-julia--exploring-shared-philosophies-in-julia-and-emacs--gabriele-bozzola--answers.vtt b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-julia--exploring-shared-philosophies-in-julia-and-emacs--gabriele-bozzola--answers.vtt
index d37f80ef..5f0d3fc5 100644
--- a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-julia--exploring-shared-philosophies-in-julia-and-emacs--gabriele-bozzola--answers.vtt
+++ b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-julia--exploring-shared-philosophies-in-julia-and-emacs--gabriele-bozzola--answers.vtt
@@ -2,345 +2,345 @@ WEBVTT
NOTE Q: Do you have any suggestions for interactive debugging of Julia code in Emacs?
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... answer to that. I, I think the infrastructure for an
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ecosystem in Julia in general is as mature as other
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languages, and even debugger infiltrator themselves are
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not particularly well developed. And so I don't think
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there's much we can do about that right now. I think that it's
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unfortunate that most of the development for these type of
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tools is tightly linked to VS code. But even there, I don't
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think that there's much done in terms of interactive
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debugging. So I, yeah, I think this has to be worked on mostly
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on the Julia side first. And then probably Emacs can get
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something out of that. I know that there's development in
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debugger.jl itself for future releases to make it at least
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faster and more stable. But yeah, I think we're not there as
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Julia community itself. So let alone Emacs, integration
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with Emacs. The way I personally debug is mostly using,
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well, debugger and infiltrator with Julia REPL mode in
NOTE Q: Can you call out something that Julia has that Emacs does not, and which could benefit Emacs?
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Emacs. The second question, can you call out something that
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Julia has that Emacs does not and which could benefit Emacs?
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Nothing stands out to me except the usual multi-threading
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and things like this. I don't necessarily see something
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that Julia has going on that DMX doesn't have, but I see some
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differences and approaches that I think are important,
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like the community. I think Julia is a very active and tight
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community. Julia uses Slack and is very, very active. I
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think he might say something like that, but it's maybe more
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on Reddit, IRC. JuliaCon is big and brings together lots and
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lots of people. And I think the sense of community is really
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powerful. It's very easy to essentially meet people that
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are interested in what we're building and interested in
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what we're doing and interested in Julian, our, you know,
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hacker spirit. I think Emacs is a very strong community.
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We're here on a Saturday talking about Emacs, which again
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proves that we are doing this. But I'd like to emphasize that
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the community is a really important aspect in Julia that I
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think we should double down on our side. The next question is
NOTE Q: Is there a way to use lisp syntax with Julia, like hy for python or lisp flavoured erlang?
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about Lisp syntax with Julia, like what we can do in Python.
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I don't think that's, I don't, I am not aware of any package
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that does that. I would bet that there's something there. I
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think that that's possible. Indeed, there used to be a Lisp
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interpreter in Julia itself until the latest release. The
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syntax parsing was done with a Lisp, it was called TemtoList
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indeed. I think this got rid, get rid of this for our more
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Julia-based solution that is faster and with better code
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provenance. I think that it should be possible to use the
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metaprogramming features in Julia to change the structure
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of your syntax to be a Lispy syntax. I do want to emphasize
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that Julia is heavily inspired by Lisp, so I wouldn't be
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surprised if if something like this were possible.
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I have tried Julia Snail.
NOTE Q: Have you tried the Julia Snail package for Emacs? It tries to be like SLY/SLIME for Common Lisp.
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So the next question is about Julia
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Snail. I found Julia REPL to be a little bit easier to set up
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and use. So I just settled on that. I should maybe revisit
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that. In particular, I use the Julia REPL with the vterm
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backend, which essentially makes a companion REPL to my
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scripts. And that works for me. I do think that the tooling
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uh, could be improved. I think there is definitely much room
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and I would like to see improvement in that area. Um, and, uh,
NOTE Q: Is there a data inspector for a Julia REPL available that you can use in Emacs?
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so we have data inspector for Julia REPL.
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I don't think so. I don't, is there any data inspector
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in for, for the Julia REPL that we can use in Emacs?
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I'm not sure. I don't think so.
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I think the way I look at data is
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essentially ignoring Emacs when encoded. It's just using the
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REPL. And again, with Julia REPL. So I'm not aware of any
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specialized tool And again, maybe this is, again, a good
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moment to emphasize that tooling, the Julia community
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clusters around VS Code. And there is tools like the, pretty
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much all the work with VS Code, unfortunately. And while
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there's a very, very decent Julia mode and Julia repo mode
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and Julia snail, there's definitely, definitely room for
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improvement.
NOTE Q: Have you tried literate programming Julia (using Org babel or some other means) in Emacs?
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Next, we have a question about literate programming in
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Julia. I haven't done much of it with Org Babel or
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anything else. I haven't done much of it. I can say that Julia
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has developed a new iteration of notebooks called Pluto.
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Here I'm thinking about Jupyter notebooks. The Pluto
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notebooks for Julia try to remove a bunch of the pain points
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that Jupyter notebooks have, meaning you cannot easily
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commit them to Git or things like this.
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I haven't used them, but I know some people are very fond of
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them. And so I think that that's what some of the Julia
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community would use for notebooks. And I think they can
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interact with Emacs with no problem. And that would be a form
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of later programming. But if you can do it in Python, you can
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do it in Julia. I think there is no reason. And actually, you
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can take advantage of all this just-in-time or
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just-out-of-time compilation by keeping the same
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session. So I think it will be definitely a nice use case. So
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these are the questions that I see here. I'm going to scroll
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through the comments and see if there's something that I
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should say about comments. I'm excited people want to learn
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Julia. I have to say that if I want to do GPU computing
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nowadays, I find it much easier to do it with Julia than with
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CUDA. So I encourage people to look into that. And I do,
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again, I would like to share what makes me excited about
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Emacs, about this being open, being collaborative, being
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respectable with documentation is something that I find in
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Julia. So I think people that are excited about the same
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features will find a little bit of joy in working with Julia.
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I think I addressed what I have here. I don't know if there's
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anything else that I should add.
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It took me a minute to unmute there.
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No, I think that was awesome. And thank you so much.
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I guess I thought it would
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+00:08:00.120 --> 00:08:06.279
collapse that shared area on BBB, my mistake, on the stream,
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+00:08:06.280 --> 00:08:12.359
or I would have left it open. But in any case, no, I thought
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that was great. You did a great job of responding to all the
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questions and comments. And thank you again so much for your
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talk and getting us all excited to learn Julia. Thank you.
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Enjoy EmacsConf. And again, thanks so much for attending,
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for being EmacsConf. Thank you.
diff --git a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-transducers--transducers-finally-ergonomic-data-processing-for-emacs--colin-woodbury--answers.vtt b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-transducers--transducers-finally-ergonomic-data-processing-for-emacs--colin-woodbury--answers.vtt
index 375cad2a..e8cb84c4 100644
--- a/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-transducers--transducers-finally-ergonomic-data-processing-for-emacs--colin-woodbury--answers.vtt
+++ b/2024/captions/emacsconf-2024-transducers--transducers-finally-ergonomic-data-processing-for-emacs--colin-woodbury--answers.vtt
@@ -10,7 +10,7 @@ morning here in Tokyo.
Are we connected all right?
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-Okay, I seem to be struggling still with my audio. 1 2nd
+Okay, I seem to be struggling still with my audio. One second...
00:00:40.880 --> 00:00:44.519
calling. Yeah, you were muted for a moment there. Okay,